NAFPS Forum
Odds and Ends => Etcetera => Topic started by: E.P. Grondine on March 24, 2010, 01:12:55 am
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I don't think I've ever seen anyone try it.
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what is a mide? never have heard the term.
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what is a mide? never have heard the term.
Perhaps you may recognize the term midewiwin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midewiwin
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Nope never have, but if it translates to 'medicine man' then I think that there are plenty who have tried to pass their self off as such. :)
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Nope never have, but if it translates to 'medicine man' then I think that there are plenty who have tried to pass their self off as such. :)
It does not really translate to "medicine man". For that matter it does not translate well at all.
But while I've seen frauds trying to operate as Cherokee, Sioux, and "Pueblo", I don't think I've seen any fraud trying to pass themselves off as Objibwe, Odawa or Potawatomi .
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That is because the midewin has done a great job of protecting their culture from the outside,
they keep it secert and don't allow nons in. The mde way needs to be kept secert and away from
nons, we need to protect all medicines. I honor them.
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Maybe this thread should be deleted so passer by's don't hook onto this and start investigating and exploiting them?
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Maybe this thread should be deleted so passer by's don't hook onto this and start investigating and exploiting them?
No, please.
I have said nothing here that has not been shared with the public by midewiwin.
To the best of my knowledge, no one has ever fraudulently passed themselves off as mide.
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That is because the midewin has done a great job of protecting their culture from the outside, they keep it secret and don't allow nons in. The mde way needs to be kept secret and away from nons, we need to protect all medicines. I honor them.
I wish the Siouxian peoples and the western peoples and their leaders and spiritual guides all the best in their efforts to protect their beliefs from thieving frauds.
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Well, now, as a person who never heard of the term, I now know they are somehow part of the Sioux, and are some sort of medicine people. Maybe that's not a lot of info, but to me, I've learned a whole lot in just a few days about them, whereas before, they were completely unknown to me.
I'm just this white person, fortunately NOT looking to find a new and improved term to exploit to get the customers away from the competition.
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Well, now, as a person who never heard of the term, I now know they are somehow part of the Sioux,
Algonquin, not Sioux, to my knowledge.
and are some sort of medicine people.
Mide are mide.
I'm just this white person, fortunately NOT looking to find a new and improved term to exploit to get the customers away from the competition.
?
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I did not mean that they were related to us the Lakota.
They have their owe culture.
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I'm simply pointing out that if this group is protecting themselves from the outside and keeping secret, then this thread is not doing them any good.
If I were an exploiter and wanted to make more money, hey, I just found a new group I'd never heard of and would not have heard of. But now, I can do a little research and a lot of harm.. that is what I am saying.. IF I were that type of person, which I'm not.
But any 'smart' and savvy money making exploiter could and probably would based on info provided here.
If they are trying to keep protected and secret, then this thread is dis-honoring that IMO.. and personally, I'd simply delete the thread. But not my call to do.
However, I will no longer post to it so perhaps it can get buried under..
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im with critter kill this thread protect them as we would want to be protected
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I think the Midewewin can protect themselves better than people who admit they have no knowledge of them. Knowledge is the only tool that Traditional People have against the real fraudsters. In the 'Ontario' region it would be vary difficult to pass oneself off as Mide being that there are many who frequent social, cultural and political NDN institutions. By educating those who would be duped by unscrupulous people. It appears that there are many people on this site with their hearts in the right places but lacking in experience and/or knowledge of various societies they intend to safeguard. I myself recently received a message from someone who admitted no knowledge of the Mide and still somehow managed to sound like an authority of the misuse of Mide knowledge. The Midewewin does not need an fraudster-oversight body. If this site absolutely feels the need to take on this role from the Mide, then I suggest calling Jim Dumont, Eddie Benton-Banai or the other DoorKeepers and offer this website's assistance. I anticipate though, that they would take issue with their membership individually being potentially at the mercy of some uneducated ones. The Midewewin is not a secret society, although it does have its secrets which it deserves to maintain of its own volition.
With no malice intended I ask: Why do we not give historians,environmental organizations, public school and university educators, and non-governmental organizations such a difficult time when they try and pass on made up histories or accepted imposed histories, cultural quips, 'Keepers of the Earth' monikers... and the like?
However, all that being said, they may even offer up a list of names to add to a Topic Page. If I see names of legitimate Midewedjig I would have to (as someone who does know better) offer this information to Jim Dumont or Eddie Benton myself.
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I think you misunderstood me. I have no ability to protect something I am not part of. I do have the ability to not speak of things that are best left to those who know of it.. and not best to be thrown to people only looking to make a buck by pretending.
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hi patrick, i am baffled at how you arrived at the conclusion that this forum intended to set them selves up as a protector of the Midewiwin, by the simple question EP Grondine asked to start this thread. EP is a valuable scholar and has earned tremendous trust here in this forum, ask him for a copy of his Treatise on Cults, its one of the most fascinated reads i ever encountered. i also am baffled and actually take exception to the statement that there are many people here who have their hearts in the right place but are lacking in the experience and knowledge of the people they intend to safe guard. this couldn't be more far than the truth. we have many in this forum who are authorities on their people, and who live in Native Communities such as I. So it seems you have based this on one personal message you received. As well how did you come to the conclusion that we do not address these issues when ever they appear, as to Historians, Public Schools, Environmental Organizations in fact we do! Heres an example: when the Province of New Brunswick Education Dept. hired a Aboriginal Consultant, who's Native wife was taken in and became a practicer of the fraudulent Medicine Wheel and they managed to insert the Medicine Wheel into the entire public school curriculum with the help of the University of New Brunswick; heres the post on our Forum:
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1161.0 We here have taken a stand against the University of New Brunswick for their collusion in this.
Finally you came to the conclusion that we are simply to give people a hard time? Let me tell you, there are many here who are not arm-chair theorists, casting judgments here and there; where for them they have replaced the quill with a key-stroke, We are here in the trenches fighting the colonialist imperatives, fighting daily against the assaults on the Native Peoples. It is more than an uphill battle, do you understand in my community of Eskasoni First Nation we have had over 40 youth suicided in the past 2 years, for a community of 2500 that means we have lost 15% of our entire community to suicide! And its directly related to the colonialism we speak out about here. We cry every nite for all the assaults being perpetrated against our people now that we live with the legacy of the Residential Schools, (my mom was sent to the Shubenacadie Residential School). i beg you to you to spend a few days reading ALL the posts in this forum, i did when i first joined, so now when anyone posts, i know fairly well what their place is in our Societies and generally know how they feel about many topics even tho i may have never communicated with them directly because ive read all their posts; and as with any forum we have newcomers who tend to post more, who are here as a result of serendipity not because they are advocates or activists. They bring a freshness and eagerness that is revitalizing to our forum. As well as we are waiting for your introduction in the new members section.
now i want to address some of the topics picked up in this thread.
The translation of Midewiwin. When Madeline brought the Midewiwin Grandmothers and the Little Boy Drum to Wapana'kik (Maritime Canada) for the Grand Unification Gatherings last year, i understand (i didn't attend the gathering, last year was a year of chemo for me) that time was spent on translating the term Midewiwin. Some Wulustukawaj (Maliseet) say the term Mide refers to the sound of the water-drum, and in their language its translated as Metawolin, which in modern day means Medicine Man. The Grandmothers wanted to know how we Mi'kmaw translate it, as the Anishanbek are Mi'kmaq progeny. We translate it as Mekwi'ta'temek (the "Remember-ers" inferring they remember and carry the OLD ways) but this is an archaic Mi'kmaw term thats not really used nowadays, some of my peers who are fluent feel that the theres a sense of that term being more honorific than just a simple noun.
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Hello,
In all fairness I haven't read the complete post above by Apukjij, my comment is referring to the reaction to Mr. Grondine's post, which seemed to me to be more of a knee-jerk response. [Posted by: critter
Maybe this thread should be deleted so passer by's don't hook onto this and start investigating and exploiting them?]
I will faithfully read the post by Apukjij tomorrow.
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There is no knee jerk reaction to what I posted. EP was talking that these people are
basically not known, or not known well. Thru the various threads in this forum I read
over and over again how frauds con people. And how extravagant they can be and make
use of what is little known to make sound like it is something better than the competition..
or make things up altogether .. the whole point is to draw in the people's money by proclaiming
a better or new or different "product". And what EP was saying sounded elusive.. so
for a moment, I considered how frauds could use that.. and saw potential and spoke on that.
That is how my mind works, and if you wanted to know why not just ask directly?
I'm not going to apologize for caring. Or for speaking up on things I have concern on. I
trust the good people on this board will educate me if I am being ignorant and talking
stupid.
Quite clearly, I do not understand what I am beginning to feel as an attack on me.
You indirectly speak about me, and I replied.. then you again, indirectly question
my post. If you have questions, ask me directly.. this is really imo, disrespectful.
Thank you.