CIA - New Age "Guru" Connection

[cleardreamer]

I wonder what people's thoughts are on what educatedindian said in this post http://newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1001.msg5453#msg5453 regarding the overlap between some of these exploiters and having been involved with the CIA. I'm familiar with Harley Regan (eeeewwww!) from having done some reading about people on the lists of known frauds that are around on the web. I didn't know about the CIA connection in his case.

What is it that spurs these people to ditch their involvment in politics and go on the New Age circuit as self-proclaimed masters, teachers, and spiritual leaders? Is it just the promise of making easy money and getting the ego gratified in the process by gullible, wide eyed followers? Or does it involve a desire to distance themselves (or cut themselves off altogether) from their questionable pasts? Or maybe things got too hot for them in the frying pan, so they jumped ship? I know that since we obviously can't get into these people's heads, there's no way of knowing for sure and it goes without saying that the reasons are likely multifaceted (and somewhat relative to the individual), but what do you folks think?

[wolfhawaii]

It's all about "control".... there is a long history of intelligence operations revolving around spiritual movements ....research Theosophy for a background. I have met a number of yoneg looking people claiming Cherokee who also claim an intelligence background....velly intelesting....

[Barnaby_McEwan]

I wonder what people's thoughts are on what educatedindian said in this post http://newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1001.msg5453#msg5453 regarding the overlap between some of these exploiters and having been involved with the CIA. I'm familiar with Harley Regan (eeeewwww!) from having done some reading about people on the lists of known frauds that are around on the web. I didn't know about the CIA connection in his case.

Harley Reagan is an absurd fantasist. He says he survived falling 300 feet into the jungle in Vietnam after his helicopter was shot down, that he helped to design the space shuttle, etc, etc. His claims of being involved in "black ops" should be viewed in that light.

[educatedindian]

The economic hit man is almost certainly making it up too. Just like being the Great White Savior of the NDNs is a fantasy, so is being a James Bond wannabe.

Still, I think Clear stumbled onto a point we've made before. You might want to look at an old thread, Fascism and the New Age. At first glance Nuage might seem to be nothing but fluffiness, touchy feely beliefs, and the most wide eyed kinds of liberalism, there's an ugly streak of racism and hunger for power in most Nuage leaders and many of the followers. Old Harley is definitely on the far right, preaching race war and being a big figure in the Arizona NRA.

I'm not saying it's not possible the connection could be true in Moss's case. The Moonies' ties to the CIA and KCIA are well known. Religious organizations make good cover for covert ops. It's likely most of the Moonies' funds come straight from the KCIA. Christian groups do their share of this. The number one recruiting site for the CIA is Brigham Young University, where they have less reason to worry about agents being vulnerable to blackmail from drinking, drug use, or affairs, and where Mormon social networks keep close track of their members anyway. Opus Dei has ties to a lot of dictatorships in Latin America's history. But so far I don't know of any Nuage group that has intel links.

[Ric_Richardson]

Tansi;

I could easily see connections between the CIA and their development into the New Age, using Native interest, as possible.  I met, in 1974, a man called Doug Durham, who infiltrated some Native organizations.  Although he was acting in Canada, when I met him, he was reputed to be FBI and some allegations were made that he was "previously" with the CIA.  As an agent/provocateur, he encouraged violence while we prepared for peaceful demonstrations on Parliament Hill, in our nation's capital, Ottawa.

Could this have been going on for some time, with a goal of further discrediting or controlling Native people and the perception of us, by non-natives?

Just my conspiratorial mind at work, maybe?
Ric

[frederica]

I think it's always been there, then and now. No one really knows who is behind half of these individuals or groups (One Nation mostly considered gas and oil). They come in, try to stir things up, throw in a little righteous indignation and you end up with the perfect manuplation. I don't think they are as successful as once was. But that doesn't mean they are still not busy. frederica

[educatedindian]

Ric, a few years before you joined us, NAFPS had a bit of disruption from an associate of a retired FBI agent. The guy posed as "Sioux" and Mike Two Horses exposed him pretty quickly. He also uncovered the guy's online conversations with this retired fed. The retired agent had at one time been part of undercover work against AIM back in the 70s. This wasn't Durham though. The infiltration was so clumsy I have a hard time believing it was anything but one or two guys acting on their own.

[wolfhawaii]

Durham was an acknowledged FBI agent at the time he was head of security for AIM. I heard he died a couple of years ago. He was a part of the COINTELPRO (Counterintelligence program) the FBI used to neutralize activist groups in the 60s and 70s....allegedly it was scrapped but I have my doubts.

[Mo]

for several years now i have heard from other ndns at pow wows about "sh$$ stirrers" who show up now and then to get controversy going. i saw one myself..a little old lady. she must have been in her 70s at least. started out nice enough but soon it degenerated into lies about casinos and who is profiting..basically trying to pit one ndn nation against another. then she slipped and told us how she worked for many years for the government so she knows these things.

well..i guess being an undercover trouble maker for the government beats bagging groceries at the local stop and shop like most seniors do to suppliment social security.