Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"

[Piff]

Archive of a past forum run by Gerald - Native American Paranormal View https://web.archive.org/web/20121121014721/http://www.bigorb.com/orbs/society-and-culture/religion-and-spirituality/nativeamericanparanormal

Gerald used the names Thunder Bow and Mountain Lion. https://web.archive.org/web/20120217221246/http://www.bigorb.com:80/member/profile/9649

As for his claim that we are playing the  "Ain't it awful" game, he has used this phrase to troll people since at least 2012: https://www.google.com/search?q=thunderbow+%22ain%27t+it+awful%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

He identifies elsewhere as a "Navajo Shaman".

[Thunderbow]

Gerald, you say that you are a Navajo Medicine Man of the Tsinaiijii Clan.

Those are very specific claims that involve community identifiers. These are not claims to be made in personal isolation.

Asking you who your people are (in response to your claims) is a normal, informed response. You may try to paint this as anger but you are incorrect.

Hey, maybe some of us know your people! That would be cool, right? Community would be shared.

The Navajo Nation is a real Nation with real people in it. They really have their own enrollment requirements and their own Nation to Nation relationship with the USA.

If I was Navajo I would have lots of experience talking about who my people are. I would enjoy talking about family and community, as a member.

If I had heritage but not enough to enroll, I would be upfront about that. I would not make any dishonest claims. I would work to be a good community member.

If I said I was Navajo but I was not, I would be lying. My lies would be horribly rude and disrespectful to The People & Nation I was misrepresenting.

Those remarks of mine were all taken out of context. You are being Misled. I will NOT expose my family to invalidation in this form, or will I expose my clan relations in this forum. Read the whole  links for yourself, not the the copy paste fragments. The Invalidation and Anger is see here is Intense! Worse than any political campaign.

[Piff]

Gerald:

are you Navajo?

[Thunderbow]

Of course I am Navajo. It is interesting to see, that they left out my Facebook posts that I attended Shiprock High School. That I lived in Shonto AZ 86053. Gerald mclaren was my roommate in the Grand Canyon. I think the housing office put him with me because we had the same 1st names. The selective misleading quotes and accompaning misinterpertations are fun to read and learn from. Please post more here, please dig up more. This is interesting. Oh, don't forget my spelling errors!

[educatedindian]

Your spam posts and the more childish rants are removed. We don't reward immaturity.

Your age claims are a bit off. On FB, it's 64. On your NAFPS profile you claim 70. Given your posts, your emotional age is closer to 17, sometimes 7.

The "Tsinaiijii Clan"...I'm guessing you meant Tsinajinnie. That's not a typo, it's a different way of saying the word, with three added syllables. No one else uses that spelling or pronunciation anywhere. Just you.

And you should have known we would spot that. Do you know just how many famous Tsinajinnies there are? Delphine the famous singer, Andrew the painter, and his daughter Hulleah also an artist and educator. But it seems you don't know any of that.

Just as important is that your mindset and beliefs are colonialist, including some racism and anti gay ideas. If you want to debate you can. We are an open forum. The attacks we don't allow.

[Piff]

Gerald, are you enrolled in the Navajo Nation?

[Thunderbow]

Of course I am enrolled.

[Thunderbow]

Note: My name is incomplete as listed. This is for my protection, a lesson proven here.

[Thunderbow]

Your spam posts and the more childish rants are removed. We don't reward immaturity.

Your age claims are a bit off. On FB, it's 64. On your NAFPS profile you claim 70. Given your posts, your emotional age is closer to 17, sometimes 7.

The "Tsinaiijii Clan"...I'm guessing you meant Tsinajinnie. That's not a typo, it's a different way of saying the word, with three added syllables. No one else uses that spelling or pronunciation anywhere. Just you.

And you should have known we would spot that. Do you know just how many famous Tsinajinnies there are? Delphine the famous singer, Andrew the painter, and his daughter Hulleah also an artist and educator. But it seems you don't know any of that.

Just as important is that your mindset and beliefs are colonialist, including some racism and anti gay ideas. If you want to debate you can. We are an open forum. The attacks we don't allow.

You don't allow attacks? I was attacked personally right from the start. Innocent Peoples names were disclosed and personal info posted for all to see. Subject to identity theft. Almost everything I posted on the internet was attacked and invalidated, and displayed. With nasty little opinions attached. I E. Mailed Mr. Mclaren as to the disclosure of his personal information. Shame on you!

[educatedindian]

McLaren's name is public, for anyone to see.
The public information on McLaren, posted by him, includes his age. It is 70, identical to Thunderbow/Tall Tree.
4 more spam posts were removed. An emotional age closer to 7 than 70...

[Piff]

Thunderbow / Gerald McLaren's 2013 defense of Hyemeyohsts Storm/ Charles Storm http://www.spiritualinspiration.org/t8594-vision-quest
Our coverage of Storm here: http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=899.0

When this information was brought up http://www.psiram.com/en/index.php/Hyemeyohsts_Storm , Gerald responded in a fashion that we now also seen on NAFPS. I bolded some of the repeated themes.

I think the term "Plastic Shaman" is over used to invalidate much. I always considered Storm to be a writer, not a "Shaman". I knew he gave workshops in Santa Cruz CA at on time. The Story is Cheyenne, and if you read the book he states that fact. People who gets to close to the truth gets ridiculed all the time.

I want to discuss the Story and how it relates to perceiving and the Vision Quest, rather than about H. Storm personally. How does the Story of Jumping Mouse relates to the Vision Quest? I do think this story is an Old Story. If we invalidate so much out of life, we will learn nothing. Lets break out of culterually imprinted negativity and learn.

The Internet has so much Negativity on it, that it makes me sick. It seems many like to dump their anger and sour feelings there, because they know they can get away with it. Also it is a way for them to have some Control. We must be very-very careful when quoting things from the internet.

Never Ever consider what you read on the internet to be truth. Form your own opinions, and research even more. Also I suggest you read "Seven Arrows" cover to cover before making judgement because what others say anbout it on or off line.

We are now totally lost forever in the Mean Spirited Invalidation of Seven Arrows. I knew only a little of the conterversy, but not much. After reading your quotes I am only more saddened. I done independent research on some of the stories, all though not exact, they are close. Most Native stories are changed, and none are told in the old ways. Thus who are those in the quote are really right?

By seeing the Name calling, in the quote only alerts me to Mean Spirited accusations. Storm is a half breed, half white, half Cheyenne. I will not defend him personally for I feel the accusations are not important to the issue. There is to much of this Mean Spirited stuff going on in the modern world as it is. Those who accuse never had any real connection to what was said in the stories. They are Angry people who are going around finding people and places to dump their anger on.

I will NOT let those kind of people rob me of the connections I found in some of the stories in "Seven Arrows". If you want to let that crap you quoted  influence you, go ahead! I do will not let that kind of crap influence me. It only robs me of seeing and learning. It only keeps me blind, lost in an angry world of accusations. I Never Ever, will let those kind of remarks influence my thinking, on any book, way, or a people. I don't care what "Authority" those in your quote may have. But when people speak in the way they do, I begin to question them. I will not let others define "What Is Indian" to me.

All the stuff you been posting is just Modern Angry People who are very ignorant of their true heritage, who are seeking control in cyber space.

I am Traditional, thus I see differently than you do when it comes Native American Stories. I can tell what is more true to the older ways of a hunting gathering people. I can tell the difference between stories influenced by the modern world, and those that survived from our ancestors. I see this in all other Tribes, as well as my own. One needs not to be knowledge able in other tribes teachings to know what teaching is adapted to the modern world, and those that came from the Ancestors of long ago.

In my Nation this is also a problem I am always battling. To preserve our original teachings, I must battle the modern adaptations that show up on the internet, that change their meanings. The truths in original stories such as "Jumping Mouse" as told in Seven Arrows, do apply to modern times as well as the old days. Look into your mind and your feelings to see this, and don't just react to Negative write ups you read on the internet.

[Piff]

One of Gerald's earlier sites is archived here: https://web.archive.org/web/20040215121907/http://stormrunneraz.tripod.com:80/growingtree/id8.html

Contact info here: https://web.archive.org/web/20040215121635/http://stormrunneraz.tripod.com:80/growingtree/id7.html which gives us an email and name to google on. Which leads us to a comment he posted in 2003, with now familiar themes:

Ya'at'eeh! I have read your  Web Site enough! I assume your Lakota. Some parts of you web page is very beautiful. RosePhoto directed to your pages. I see your Sickness clearly. I dug into your "Rantings" about Politics.I seen this kind of Anger Sickness in the Political Rooms on AOL. Seems most Bush supporters have this Sickness. I see a commen thread of intense Anger. I don't mean to be cruel .. but your Blindness may be because you don't want to see. Anger is Blinding .. take my word for it. You got alot of it in You. If you can view my web pages at: I am Growing Tree so See what life can be without the kind of Anger I see in you. Walk in beauty; Growing Tree

http://www.snowwowl.com/gl3.html

[RedRightHand]

Pretty weird when some unhinged white stranger shows up on your doorstep, screaming, "You do not intimidate me!!!! "

Uh, who are you again?

Right, another crazy white man. Never heard of you.

Look, dude, we meet your kind every day. Nothing new about you. You want attention, we get it. You've reached the state where negative attention feels better than being ignored.  It's hard living all alone when you're 70. That's sad that you're so lonely.

But it's not sad enough to look the other way while you lie to people and misrepresent Dineh and other Native cultures. That's harmful to the cultures, and the cultures are worth more than you, or any one of us as individuals. Maybe you've found some personal comfort in your fantasies but the comfort stops when you start spreading these lies online and giving horrible, harmful advice to vulnerable people as fake "medicine".

You showed up here to start this. No one came after you and your tiny little message board. No one knew about you and no one cared.  Clearly you thought stirring up some kind of battle here would work in your favor. Sorry to disappoint you, Mr. McLaren. You've earned yourself some pity, and now some genuine criticism for the psychological harm you've caused on those message boards. You've managed to work up your blood pressure, waste our time and annoy some good people. It's too bad that these are your goals for the final years of your life.