Amylee She Who Catches the Rainbows

[SouthwestSkeptic]

That’s o.k.

I have to work with people like this all day.  When they have nothing intelligent to contribute to the discussion, their feelings of jealousy and inadequacy compel them try to pick a fight about any trivial they can find.  They do this because they fear that this verbal sniping is the only way that anyone will pay attention to them, since they lack wit and talent to draw attention to themselves in a good way.  I really don’t see why the person calling themselves “crazy eagle??? would assume that I was referring to him/her when I paid a compliment to the intelligence of the Natives in this group -- I wasn't.   By the way, since I am a skeptic, I know better than to believe in the artificial construct of "race".  Come to think of it, I don't think I'v ever heard a P.Y/T.O use the term.  I hear it a lot at work though……

Rose

[SouthwestSkeptic]

Amylee must be getting desperate --

You can read about Amylee impersonating a Red Road Collective member at:

http://pub31.bravenet.com/forum/2622176167/show/742981


On the bright side, Amylee has removed all references to her Haudenausaunee lineage from her websites.
On www.medwom.com
she claims her page is in gestation.
On www.hernativeroots.com
 she has removed her picture and taken away all references to her being a Medicine woman or a descendent of the Haudenausaunee. She does makes vague references to her lineage, though.

On the other hand, she was just interviewed WBAI radio on the program First Voices Indigenous Radio (www.FirstVoicesIndigenousRadio.org ). The show is hosted by Tiokasin Ghosthorse (Lakota) who appears to be clueless about her., The show aired on April 3, 2008 show. You can listen to it in the archives at:  http://archive.wbai.org. 
Click on see all shows and scroll down to April 3rd

Or just go here: http://archive.wbai.org/allshows.php Then go down to  First Voices Indigenous Radio and click on play on the right side to hear it.

For those of you who don’t have real player, here’s a synopsis of the outlandish claims Swartz made.

She claims to have sponsored the first longest walk which pushed the bill through for religious freedom for Native pp in the US.

She claims Iroquois people passed on wisdom to her to use herbs.

Later on in the interview was lots of Newagey nonsensical  talk .. All directions converge within your own drum your own beating heart…
lots of talk about sacred mother earth and father sky
she says a lot of stuff like the whole parade of your ancestors converges inside your own beating heart and all the future dwells there too.  Lots of trite phrases but nothing of substance

She claims she was guided by many native teachers who took her out to the woods where she earned about herbs from (?) Peterson – a Haudenausaunee medicine woman. She says that the “The plants responded, they absolutely vibrated when she would take a walk to sing to them???. 

She  claims that her great great grandmother had 3 medicine bundles that she kept at  her door and that she was a midwife.

She claims that the term Medicine Woman is an inherited right and she has earned the right to be called that.

She says her grandmothers fortold that she would be an herbalist

She even has the nerve to talk about all those other  hucksters who are doing medicine shows for money.

She also claimed to be fluent in the Iroquois language, but she couldn’t translate her Indian name “She who catches rainbows??? because every word is a sentence and it would be quite a long run on sentence to combine. 

Claims she co-founded the Ohio branch of the Native American Rights Association at Kent State University.  I can’t find any mention of this organization anywhere. 

She never introduced herself properly in her native language or stated exactly who her people are or what rez she grew up on.  We have a radio show here on Sundays and every guest always introduces himself in the language.

She claimed again that she was the last medicine woman in her lineage and she does consultations – whatever that is.

In my opinion, hearing her voice gives you a lot of vital information about who she really is. She seemed to me to break character and get more and more silly and Newagey as the interview progressed. My skin-dar is going off.  The only time I’ve heard somebody talk about “Father sky??? is in the movies.


You can contact  Tiokasin Ghosthorse  to set him straight at:
tiokasin@gmail.com or leave a voicemail at (212) 209-2979

Any support would be greatly appreciated.  Just a few quick emails can stop radio hosts from interviewing people without checking their credentials.

Quack watch emailed me back and might do an article on her if they get more complaints.  They want to talk to someone who's been victimized.


Well that’s all I have time for now

Later,

Rose

[InHisHands]

Southwest skeptic,
As I read all of your information the only thing I can ask is what is it that she has done to you that you are attacking her in this way?

[earthw7]

she is a fraud and hurts all people including herself

[InHisHands]

I have read thru all of these comments and what people are presenting.The only thing that I continue to see is that thier is alot of speculation about alot of different things.I have to say as a women that works very hard to establish myself in life and dream,dreams that it is very scarey that you can just attack and defame someone's character.Yet it appears noone has experienced any of the things that you are attacking are we not people with minds and the abillity to make decision do we not have freedom of choice? Freedom to succeed and yes, even sometimes to fail  (that we do not always get freedom in).I try to walk my life out,treating other's as I would want to be treated. Imagine if in your life someone began to attack you and it affected your livelyhood,your family, your life? I think truth is very impotant But, grace is also as imporatnt and we have a responsibility to tell the truth and hold one another to a higher standard, that standard has to be the same for ourselves, it also is not to be done out of anger or vengence,They say vengence is a lazy mans grief.So the thing that I hope is that we could get researched truth and facts w/out defaming a whole person and there life just to make ourselves feel a little better you know what they say if you have to step on someone to feel big it usually makes you small.

[Defend the Sacred]

Imagine if in your life someone began to attack you and it affected your livelyhood,your family, your life?

Imagine if someone lied about your community, your religion, your heritage, and it affected the ability of your people to represent themselves and not have their ways stolen and sold? 

I think truth is very impotant

Then don't defend liars.

And don't come here and anonymously insult those who expose liars and frauds.

The actions of the frauds do not take place in a vacuum. The role of this forum, and the work of those who contribute productively here, is to protect seekers from being exploited, and to protect the traditional ways from being misrepresented and pimped out for the profit of liars.

that standard has to be the same for ourselves,

Good point. I would hope that anyone working here to expose frauds isn't secretly exploiting seekers, selling ceremony, or lying about themselves.

Not that we would know what you do, as you haven't even bothered to introduce yourself.

[Superdog]

I have read thru all of these comments and what people are presenting.The only thing that I continue to see is that thier is alot of speculation about alot of different things.I have to say as a women that works very hard to establish myself in life and dream,dreams that it is very scarey that you can just attack and defame someone's character.Yet it appears noone has experienced any of the things that you are attacking are we not people with minds and the abillity to make decision do we not have freedom of choice? Freedom to succeed and yes, even sometimes to fail  (that we do not always get freedom in).I try to walk my life out,treating other's as I would want to be treated. Imagine if in your life someone began to attack you and it affected your livelyhood,your family, your life? I think truth is very impotant But, grace is also as imporatnt and we have a responsibility to tell the truth and hold one another to a higher standard, that standard has to be the same for ourselves, it also is not to be done out of anger or vengence,They say vengence is a lazy mans grief.So the thing that I hope is that we could get researched truth and facts w/out defaming a whole person and there life just to make ourselves feel a little better you know what they say if you have to step on someone to feel big it usually makes you small.

I'm not very well versed on Amylee, but this post appears to be written by Amylee herself.  If you're someone else Inhishands then I apologize, but that's how this comes across to me.  Do you know Amylee and can, with confidence, defend her claims.  I'm just looking for a little on-topic substance to your post.  Your words are true and I'll think you'll find that the members here subscribe to the same ideals.  It's the plastic shamans and medicine men that victimize others for profit selling lies.  They hold themselves to no standard of honesty or grace and they're practices affect the livelihood of those they claim to honor NEGATIVELY (myself included).  Our cultures and practices are not for sale.  The funny part of it is....if ANYONE wanted to legitimately learn...all they would need to do is start asking in a respectful way and earn people's trust by being a good person.  Doesn't cost anyone anything, but the plastic shaman/medicine man/cultural appropriator and profiteer leads good people away from that and into their own interpretation of things....which often leads them to dangers they were unaware of.

So back to the topic...do you know Amylee?  What can you say about her?

Superdog

[InHisHands]

Superdog,

Thank you, for the respect and understanding of what I was saying and asking,Instaed of attacking me.
1st off no I am not Amylee,I am a self employed women who believes very much in encouraging and uplifting women to be the best that they can be,I truly understand what  is being sought after here is to present truth.I just believe that truth can be ministered to a person in love and grace and if someone is wrong you help them to see and show them why, not tear them down.So ,this is hard for me to understand because all I have really read is hear say and what little pieces people have found.to encourage attcking someone's funding because you believe something is happening doesn't seem fair I know I would not want that done to me.I did not see where anyone had experienced or seen first hand what was going on it is all speculation.If I missing something please let me know.Yes,I do know Amylee Thanks,Kathy

[Superdog]

Superdog,

Thank you, for the respect and understanding of what I was saying and asking,Instaed of attacking me.
1st off no I am not Amylee,I am a self employed women who believes very much in encouraging and uplifting women to be the best that they can be,I truly understand what  is being sought after here is to present truth.I just believe that truth can be ministered to a person in love and grace and if someone is wrong you help them to see and show them why, not tear them down.So ,this is hard for me to understand because all I have really read is hear say and what little pieces people have found.to encourage attcking someone's funding because you believe something is happening doesn't seem fair I know I would not want that done to me.I did not see where anyone had experienced or seen first hand what was going on it is all speculation.If I missing something please let me know.Yes,I do know Amylee Thanks,Kathy

Hello Kathy, thanks for introducing yourself.  I can understand your point of view and I'm not saying your wrong.  What I'm saying is if you really see something wrongly put up here then you certainly have the chance to try and make things better for your friend.  But as I said in my previous post you need some on-topic substance.  Your last two posts are diatribes about how people should behave.  I honestly don't think you're telling anything that's brand new to anyone here.  Everyone has their own standards of behavior, but the topic is about Amylee and how truthful her claims are about her tribal heritage.  From what I've seen of her site she does a lot of claiming her products are "Native American"....but what kind???  There's over 500 different nations.  This is a huge question, because there are people firsthand who have met her and give their accounts and there seems to be inconsistency there.  It's that very inconsistency that brings people to question her because she markets her products as Native American products.

So Kathy....that's the biggest question here.  Is she Native American?  What tribe is she from?  What would she say about the tribal governments that deny their ties to her and what she teaches??

Superdog

[MatoSiWin]

"So Kathy....that's the biggest question here.  Is she Native American?  What tribe is she from?  What would she say about the tribal governments that deny their ties to her and what she teaches??"

I second this question.  I know that with over 500 nations, not all NDNs are the same, but I do know that in the Lakota way, if your people don't acknowledge you, and even take it a step further and outright say you are not of them, you can NOT claim that to be yours.  I assume it is similar, if not the same for most nations.  Amylee is claiming a nation that rejects her.  She might be able to explain that away to the wasicu who are paying her for her services, becasue they WANT to believe she is the real deal so that they can claim to have been taught NDN ways by a real NDN, but that sort of thing doesn't fly within the NDN community. 

How would you feel about someone who falsely claimed to have been a war hero, who even had a "purple heart" (that they "bought" somewhere), going around and charging money for their life story or for seminars?  would your feeling of that change if you yourself were a genuine decorated veteran?

What if you were in need of an operation, and just before surgery you heard from numerous other surgeons that your surgeon had lied about thier education and credentials and was not the "real deal"?  Would you still want them to operate on you?  (Yes, I realize that they would not be allowed to practice once their fraudulent lies had been exposed, but you see my point). 

People who claim to be something they are not cause hurt to those who trust them.  It is even worse when you are talking about a people and their culture because followers blindly believe that crap, take it as fact, and then pass thier misinformation on to others... it's like a wildfire that spreads out of control.  And guess who has to try to extinguish it?

[Defend the Sacred]

I am a self employed women who believes very much in encouraging and uplifting women to be the best that they can be,

Hi, Kathy. I have met Amylee, though I would not say I "know" her. However, a close friend of mine attended a talk and workshop with her, and other women I know have also met her and interacted with her to some degree.

While she may be making the white women who attend her events feel better about themselves, what about how she makes Native American women feel?

Her actions hurt Native American women.  So how does that equal "helping women"?

[earthw7]

As a Native Woman I am hurt by lies, how can a person help another
with lies.
A person CAN NOT CLAIM to be Native unless her tribe claims her, she
has no rights to the beliefs of the Native people. We have rite and rituals
a person must go though among their people to get these rites.
All native people have a right to ask who are you
What tribe claims you? who are your relatives? who taught you?
Who are your witnesses?

Oh most people since the beginning of time have witnesses who can
stand up for them and say they have these rights.

[Defend the Sacred]

I think any "feel-good" hit that these middle-class or wealthy white women, or any women or men, get from these sorts of things is illusiory. And the herbal information she has, if followed... some of it is wrong to the point of being dangerous.

When people build their self-esteem, or their spirituality, on lies, it will tear under the weight of real life. While some of these seekers may briefly feel comforted by the illusions, on a deeper level, in reality, and in the long run, I believe they are only being harmed, as well.

[InHisHands]

Superdog, thank you.

Commnent: I did not say Amylee was my friend. That is precisely the type of rush to conclusions that is all over this site.

To answer you’re –and someothers – questions: (1) Amylee doesn’t own any products. She volunteers to help the herb company because they help Native Americans. I learned that on the link posted on your thread: www.hernativeroots.com  (Kathryn, you are so vague about what “herbal information she has is wrong and dangerous??? – people here don’t like it when someone makes vague accusations. Be specific.)

(2) From what I know and what I read on some links here on your site, AmyLee’s been retired for 15 years or so, just volunteering where she can. Isn’t picking on something she MIGHT have said or done that long ago like beating a dead horse – for 15 years – while pretending you are trying to beat a still living horse to death?  http://www.gobignetwork.com/profiles/AmyLee-ofHawkHollow.aspx

(3) What tribes ‘deny’ her? The only one you mention here is the former Chief Spicer. I say fomer because I searched him and he was removed in dissgrace. In the letter he wrote on this site, he does not name Amylee, he referrs to the person Southwest Skeptic wrote him about. Skeptic has gotten everything else wrong about her including Amylee’s ‘real’ name (I think that’s called Liable!)  It looks like chief Spicer was talking about someone who doesn’t fit the Amylee we know (My folks were neighbors for years and knew her family and her, – and yes, their Indian..) So where are all the tribes that deny her? I see none.

 So far, I don’t see any facts here and I count dozens of lies. (THAT’s what’s hurting people Earthw7!)
Why don’t you contact these people you are upset with BEFORE you post the gossip? Do you even read the links you DO post? You print all their contact information – why didn’t you use it FIRST then post their replies? Tell them who you are and what you saw somewhere else online BEFORE you post it here and ask them for a statement. I know if you contacted me AFTER you posted all those lies, and act like they are fact, I wouldn’t give you the time of day!
It is not my place to correct your mistakes you shouldn’t have made in the first place. This is not a ‘diatribe’. This is just my opinion because I know Amylee and I know a lynching when I see one.

[Dine Asdzani Nizhoni]

 author=InHisHands link=topic=1509.msg14054#msg14054 date=1220923695]
Superdog, thank you.

Commnent: I did not say Amylee was my friend. That is precisely the type of rush to conclusions that is all over this site.

To answer you’re –and someothers – questions: (1) Amylee doesn’t own any products. She volunteers to help the herb company because they help Native Americans. I learned that on the link posted on your thread: www.hernativeroots.com  (Kathryn, you are so vague about what “herbal information she has is wrong and dangerous??? – people here don’t like it when someone makes vague accusations. Be specific.)

Native herb is make by medicine men specific make  for a patient that need it. What she doing selling herb under native American labels. she is not specialized to perform any herbs treatment.

(2) From what I know and what I read on some links here on your site, AmyLee’s been retired for 15 years or so, just volunteering where she can. Isn’t picking on something she MIGHT have said or done that long ago like beating a dead horse – for 15 years – while pretending you are trying to beat a still living horse to death?  http://www.gobignetwork.com/profiles/AmyLee-ofHawkHollow.aspx

(3) What tribes ‘deny’ her? The only one you mention here is the former Chief Spicer. I say fomer because I searched him and he was removed in dissgrace. In the letter he wrote on this site, he does not name Amylee, he referrs to the person Southwest Skeptic wrote him about. Skeptic has gotten everything else wrong about her including Amylee’s ‘real’ name (I think that’s called Liable!)  It looks like chief Spicer was talking about someone who doesn’t fit the Amylee we know (My folks were neighbors for years and knew her family and her, – and yes, their Indian..) So where are all the tribes that deny her? I see none.

Is she enrolled in native american tribe and specialized herb?

 So far, I don’t see any facts here and I count dozens of lies. (THAT’s what’s hurting people Earthw7!)
Why don’t you contact these people you are upset with BEFORE you post the gossip? Do you even read the links you DO post? You print all their contact information – why didn’t you use it FIRST then post their replies? Tell them who you are and what you saw somewhere else online BEFORE you post it here and ask them for a statement. I know if you contacted me AFTER you posted all those lies, and act like they are fact, I wouldn’t give you the time of day!
It is not my place to correct your mistakes you shouldn’t have made in the first place. This is not a ‘diatribe’. This is just my opinion because I know Amylee and I know a lynching when I see one.





As far I can see someone who not enrolled in native american tribe is hurting another native american, why because one person is selling thing that is suppose to make by native american. By which it is not.
medicine men are the ppls who specialized in these area, and it take years to know what they know.
and yes it wrong to sell herbs under native american herbs, if is not make by native american.

DAN