Tsisqua

[Tsisqua]

Hello....

It has been brought to my attention that I have failed to introduce myself...and for that I am deeply ashamed and will do my best to correct....so I ask you to please accept my apologies.

People call me Tsisqua...or Tsissy...my real name is unimportant...as I find many of the issues we all deal with, are better kept AWAY from our personal lives....and since I have a family...with little ones...I will not put that at risk.

Most people here, already know from some of my past postings...I run the NAU site...and also created it...it is now maintained by myself along with a board of 12 other Native people. This site came about due to a need for a place where native people could gather, in respect...as equals...due to much abuse our people were suffering at the hands of many other sites on the web.

Our address is:

http://www.freewebs.com/americanunitymovement/

NAU Yahoo Group:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NAU_NativeAmericanUnity/

NAU Community Network:

http://nativeamericanunity.ning.com/

NAU Native Singles Network:

http://nausinglesnetwork.ning.com/

NAU Forum:

http://nativeamericanunity.aceboard.com/

We have a huge mailing list of members...which is steadily growing daily...however, we are not all interested in being vocal towards the wrongs inflicted on our people at NAU...but many of us are...our member list consists of ndn people...some enrolled....some not...some who wish to gain information on various subjects...some who wish to be more involved...and indeed, some who simply want a place to come to.....and we are always open to suggestions on how to improve our site.

We have many chat rooms on site...including youth rooms...and we arrange weekly times to meet there...we are not a dating site...more of an informative site, and a place for native unity.

We also run a NAIS program...(Native American Inmate Support)...of which many members actively get involved in....NAIS has been ongoing for the past 6 years now...and we reach as many of our brothers and sisters in the Iron House as we possibly can...also encouraging others to do the same through supportive letters...to the inmates and their family members....also by speaking out against the injustice many of our people face whilst incarcerated...ie lack of spiritual freedom, etc.

A large body of our members are actively involved in American Indian Injustices...also Animal Rights...and we regularly send out alerts via our mailing list to make sure our members are fully aware of new cases...and indeed how they can help on these matters...as too are we alerted to many cases via our members...and sometimes by non members....working together to make changes for our people is our goal...creating a unified voice of many ndn people from various...and indeed all ndn nations....is our goal....supporting our people and raising our voices where possible....is our goal.

We are a 100% free site...all the work we do is 100% free and on our own time. We do not ask for donations to maintain our site...and nor will we ever ask for such. Choosing Freeweb as our host....was a statement in itself. It was to show that a Native Site CAN be free....we do not believe in taking money from our people....as my previous posting regarding Tribal America hopefully shows.

Our board members are as follows:

Myself       (Keetoowah Band of Tsalagi)
Blade        (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Skylar       (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Da'Quah   (Mohawk)
Juan          (Pawnee)
Alfie           (Quinault/White)
Lucas        (Quinault)
Jared         (Flathead/Blackfoot)
Consoni     (White Mountain Apache)
Clint          (Onieda/Mohawk/White)
Marcus      (Haidian)

(edited to remove two board members who are currently being replaced 06/26/08)

Either of our board members can be reached at our NAU office address of NativeAmericanUnity@gmail.com (edited to change email address)

I do not wish to mislead anyone....I say office...but in actual fact we work from many places...although we all avail of the main office email address...as we are all from various nations and locations.

We are basically a large body of Native People doing the best we can to speak up when needed....and to create a unity within our people. Blood quantum is not an issue with NAU...and will never become an issue....although we obviously draw the line at fakes posing as Native people.

I do not know what else to say here...except that again...I apologize for not introducing myself sooner....and I feel shame that I have not done so thus far...I can assure you this was not intentionally done through ignorance.

With Respect,

Tsissy

[wolfhawaii]

Ulihelisdi oniyiyu Tsisqua! (Welcome Late Bird!)

[Tsisqua]

Ayv adalihelitsedi Waya.....wado

(I appreciate Wolf...thank you)

[Moma_porcupine]

Hi Tsisqua and welcome

I'm sorry if my behind the scenes nudge for you to introduce yourself made you feel ashamed - It's only because you seem to be bringing up your Native American Unity group in other threads, and that wasn't the place to discuss this.

It was this request that these people in a sensitive situaltion contact you at your office e that initially got my attention.

http://jayfulton.wordpress.com/2008/04/06/grandmother_peace_drum_and_pepper-spray/

NAU ~ Native American Unity Says:
April 10, 2008 at 11:45 am

Hartman deetz could you please contact our office at NativeAmericanUnity_Office@yahoo.com
We would appreciate it greatly…with thanks,

NAU

So, let me make sure I understand this ;

There really isn't an office. That was just a figure of speech . This NAU is an online group with a large membership ( you mentioned over 19,000 people in another thread ) and this group and website are run by a bunch of completely anonymous people that will only give their first names,  and people just have to trust that everybody is who they say they are.

You mentioned that ;

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1513.0;all
    
Re: Suraj Holzwarth aka White Eagle Medicine Woman
« Reply #32
Tsisqua

before I opened NAU...we already had over 7000 members of various other groups which we incorporated into NAU

I did a bit of digging, and found a cached page dated March 1 2008 . It is of one of the main pages of your message board .

http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:pmINyEKeP5EJ:nativeamericanunityforum.theiforum.com/
native-american-unity-forum-c1.html+%22native+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=12&gl=ca

At the bottom you will see ;

Our users have posted a total of 122 articles
We have 18 registered users
The newest registered user is Juan Wildcat-Hall
In total there is 1 user online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 1 Guest   [ Administrator ]   [ Moderator ]
Most users ever online was 4 on Mon Jan 21, 2008 12:09 pm
Registered Users: None

So if you had 7000 members before you even opened NAU why doesn't even a small fraction of this 7000 - 19,000 members show up posting on your message board?

What "various other groups " did these members that got incorporated into NAU come from?

You say the NAU is just for Native people but how do you know for sure if anyone is Indian if you only know them on line ? - and for that matter- as you all are anonymous how can anyone know that about you ?  Being able to write something in a Native language only proves whoever wrote it learned to say a few things in that language or copied a quote they liked from somewhere ...

I'm really sorry to be suspisous, but what you are saying does seem a bit odd.

I'm a bit puzzled how your group will bring about "Native American Unity" if everyone involved is anonymous. Actually the idea seems kind of funny. I guess it could really all be people in India ... LOL ...But ok ...

A bit more digging and I see the concept of a "Native American Unity " group seems to have begun at the Tribal America group you started a thread on . You mentioned this group was a website owned by people in India ...

This is actually quite bizarre considering these people are not Native people ... and they are making plans to organize the "Native American community" AND the plans are all copyrighted and owned by non natives calling themselves Tribal America !!!!!!!

http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:LEuMeo7nTXgJ:www.tribalamerica.com/nau.html+%22native
+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=ca

http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:0fp1Bn9p3n8J:www.tribalamerica.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3Ffn%3Df
%26tp%3D2006%26m%3D+%22native+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=ca

And I see you were involved in setting up the intial group called NAU and it seems to be a affiliate or a franachise of Tribal America.

http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:4OIbc1Ubm6kJ:www.tribalamerica.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3Ffn%
3Df+%22native+american+unity%22+Tsisqua&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=ca

Could you explain what NAU connections were and are with Tribal America and how this evolved or came to be seperate entities ?

It's not that I see any problem with your website  ( though most of it I can't access because I don't download plug ins ) and I don't see a problem wanting to anonymously put together accurate information for Native people on a website - I'm just not sure how a bunch of completely anonymous people on the internet are a safe rallying point for " Native Unity" ?

I hope you see what I am feeling concerned about. It does seem a bit odd ...   

[Tsisqua]

This NAU is an online group with a large membership ( you mentioned over 19,000 people in another thread ) and this group and website are run by a bunch of completely anonymous people that will only give their first names, and people just have to trust that everybody is who they say they are.

Incidently...if you notice any thread I have mentioned NAU on...the membership number has gone up over time...as over time we have gained more members. I am not expecting anyone to trust in anything I say...or indeed NAU has to say...trust is a thing earned....and I am in no hurry.  As for remaining annoymous...that is our right...do all members here post their real names? And addresses as you suggested I did here? We have lives...and families...people take us as they find us...we are not claiming to be anything other than ndn people doing the best we can....we have already had most of our site closed down due to attacks from frauds...we have had our forum hacked...which is now closed down...we have had fake pages set up in our names...we have received many threats via email...many of us have little ones...so why on earth would we be expected to give out our addresses and real names?

So if you had 7000 members before you even opened NAU why doesn't even a small fraction of this 7000 - 19,000 members show up posting on your message board?

We have no message board/forum as it was hacked and closed down. If you managed to attain this information...I am certain you too obtained my specific request on the forum for MORE MEMBERS TO JOIN AND POST. Our forum was particularly slow....99% of all our correspondance is via bulk emailing from our site....and in all honesty with our forum...it seemed as though mainly admin posted there...which was not really an issue since many of our members belong to other groups and forums also.

(Added: By the IP number on the address you provided as a cached section of our forum...I notice you were a daily visiter of our forum...and you would also know that the membership and posters had sufficiently grown by the time our forum was hacked...just an observation....infact your IP was banned several times as you were visiting our forum many many times a day without becomming a member or posting...and we presumed you were something to do with RNS...I also find this highly strange that we at NAU have come into question by you at a time when RavenCrow has been sending us emails trying to gain information from us...to no avail...are these things linked??)

Could you explain what NAU connections were and are with Tribal America and how this evolved or came to be seperate entities ?

Please see the thread in FRAUDS under Tribal America...of which yourself posted on.

You know...I have no wish to sit here quoteing every little thing you say and responding...I have nothing to prove here...I am not here scoring points...I am simply doing the very best I can...I did not realize I was under investigation here...I did however months ago contact Frederica with regards to who I am...and who I am not...and this seemed sufficient for admin.

If my trying to help support our people...and my speaking out against injustice offends you or causes you to be suspicious of me...then the same may be said for anyone posting here.

If my wish and the wishes of NAU staff to remain annoymous causes you to doubt our intentions and raises concerns...the same can be said for anyone posting here who do not give out their personal details.

I post here to help....to also gain knowledge myself...as others do...nothing more. I am not asking people for anything...Im just trying to do the very best I can.

With respect,

Tsissy

Added on: After some thought on the matter...I would like to add the following:

Re: Ravencrow and RNS Admin Throw a Fit on: March 21, 2008

Posted by Moma Porcupine:

A lot of people who post on this message board do so anonymously, and people often do have good reasons for wanting to be anonymous. Especially on this board where people who post under their real names can be subjected to some truely nasty retaliation. But if people want to be anonymous in cyberspace they need to be the ones who take reasonable precautions to remain that way.

The whole question of privacy and when people cross the line in revealing information is tricky, but in this situation, clearly the only real victim is the reputation of the mainly conscientious and responsible people, who post here, and put themselves at risk to warn the public about people who lie and take advantage of them.

And a section of a PM from Moma Porcupine:

Posting removed by request

I chose option B...since I have no desire to give out personal details of any of our members...or indeed my own personal information...since we regularly come under attack...and also since we all have families and little ones...giving out private personal information is a big no no....and if it is good enough for people here to do...well its good enough for us...So...I did what was requested on option B...to still be ripped apart. It seems this was a mere ploy to get me into a confrontation...about what exactly..I have yet to discover...NAU is exactly what is states it is...we make no false claims...we take nothing from our people...and we work hard at all we do....and we are not here to boast about who we are...nor do we claim to be anything we are not.

I'm a bit puzzled how your group will bring about "Native American Unity" if everyone involved is anonymous. Actually the idea seems kind of funny.

Does Native Unity only exist when people give out personal details? Is this your explaination of Native Unity? Is Unity not about many people supporting each other and standing together as a body of people with no prejudice? My bad....I thought it was.

I see this topic has reached the pages of RNS pretty fast also...seems many people jump on the train to try to discredit people who simply try to do the right thing....but I am looking into the sources.

I know Frederica has asked that this subject be dropped...but when accusations are made...and the credibility of a site/group/people are being called into question...I feel they should be permitted to reply to the finger pointing of others. Incidently...our site stats have tripled today...and our membership additions have been higher than usual today....so I guess those who are actually Native people...those who wish for unity...have no issue with what we do.

With respect,

Tsissy

[Moma_porcupine]

As for remaining annoymous...that is our right...do all members here post their real names? And addresses as you suggested I did here?

Tsisqua - In a PM I asked if you had an actual office, as you claimed, and asked if you did if you would give an address. If you had a real office , representing so many Native people presumably the address wouldn't be private.  I also said I understood if you wanted to remain anonymous - as long as it was clear you were just a website run by anonymus people who could be anyone - My concern was you seemed to be presenting yourself as if you have an office with a staff of real people which had the job of reprsenting 19,000 real American Indians.  Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Quote (me)

Could you explain what NAU connections were and are with Tribal America and how this evolved or came to be seperate entities ?

Quote Tsisqua

Please see the thread in FRAUDS under Tribal America...of which yourself posted on.

I only posted in that thread asking for clarification because what you were saying was hard to understand. Which has nothing to do with the question about NAU beginings and affiliation with Tribal America , a question which you did not answer.

If my wish and the wishes of NAU staff to remain annoymous causes you to doubt our intentions and raises concerns...the same can be said for anyone posting here who does not give out their personal details.

That's absolutely true, I even started a topic on this at the top orf "Research needed". On the other hand ,  there is quite a few people involved in this website who can be verified to be real people who are affiliated with real Native communities. If everybody was completely anonymous here it would rightly be a lot harder to gain anyones trust. 

I post here to help....to also gain knowledge myself...nothing more. I am not asking people for anything...Im just trying to do the very best I can.

I would guess as long as you aren't misrepresenting who you are, and it is clear that you could be anybody, that you have no office, and it is clear that 19,000 Native people in your group may be 19 people who each have 1000 email accounts, whatever you can do to help under those circumstances will probably be appreciated.

I am also posting here anonymously, but what I do here doesn't promote my own website or on line group , or even anything I am doing in another on line group, so it is a bit different.

I'm sorry to be so skeptical , it is what we do here.

( added - I have no idea what you are talking about me coming to your website too often) 

[wolfhawaii]

Moma Porcupine, I have read your posts here for several years, and i have yet to see you post who you are. Anonymity is often important to avoid repercussions in exposing frauds and abusers. I do not understand why you are pushing Tsisqua so hard; she is not "promoting" anything except a website where native folks can gather and discuss issues, for  FREE. She is posting on her site to enlist additional support to stop fraud and abuse; if she can add additional voices to our members, what is wrong with that? You have previously stated that your personal credentials are unimpressive; how then do you judge the authenticity of another without time in the community of the person you are scrutinizing? You have done a lot of good work on this site in my opinion, yet i also personally know at least one formerly valued member here who left due to your heavyhandedness. I urge you to think about your approach carefully. A witchhunt mentality is counterproductive to our purpose here.....truth will always rise to the surface in time. There are some here who are not what they seem to be; that has always been the case, and eventually the truth emerges. By their fruits you shall know them....the knife cuts both ways.

[wolfhawaii]

PS  Moma_Porcupine, I looked for your introduction on the site and was unable to find one, perhaps you could direct me to it? Wadv....

[Moma_porcupine]

Hi wolfhawaii

I have never introduced myself.

I don't want to give personal details so I don't see the point .

Yes I post here anonymously, but  I am not doing anything to draw people into a different website away from the scurtiny of the people here. There are many other people posting here who aren't anonymous, and presumably even if I'm not trustworthy, at least some of them are,  and they will probably say something if I get out of line.

So my posts here are probably less of a hazard than an anonymous person trying to attract people to an on line group called Native American Unity where everyone running it is anonymous.

As for the person you feel I was too heavy handed with - I imagine you are reffering to Joseph. It seems a lot of people come to this board to gain credibiltiy for some other enterprise. If someone is here and is criticizing people for abusing Cherokee traditions and on the side advertising Cherokee healing with energy hand and crystal work , dream interpretation spiritual and emotional guidence for $50 an hour - as this forum member was -

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1003.0

sorry I am not going to turn a blind eye and pretend that's not going on ..... And if we did that here this website would be over run with frauds and exploiters in no time . 

And I don't think I was exactly "heavy handed " i just posted what he was doing in "Research needed" . If you think what I did was unnecessary you are welcome to go say so in that thread.

I don't think what we do here would be served if we criticize some people for doing something, and then we turn a blind eye if our forum members do the same thing.

[Tsisqua]

Yes I post here anonymously, but  I am not doing anything to draw people into a different website away from the scurtiny of the people here. There are many other people posting here who aren't anonymous, and presumably even if I'm not trustworthy, at least some of them are,  and they will probably say something if I get out of line.

Moma Porcupine...with respect...I am not trying to draw members away from here...if anything I am trying to BRING MORE people here....why on earth would I wish to draw people away? I dont even understand the remark. We have advertisements for NAFPS on many places on our site asking members to come here to give support...we have also requested members to come here via our bulk mailing system...we also have an advertisement on our MySpace page blog asking our members and readers to come here to show support...also on our yahoo 360 page...of which are clear and visable....just as we ask members to support NARF and their local AIM chapter....perhaps you simply do not understand what I am about...and as I have already said...trust is a thing earnt...I have as long as it takes...I am in no hurry.

With respect,

Tsissy

[Moma_porcupine]

Tsisqua

I am not trying to draw members away from here

I meant you are trying to attract people to your website,  and by your being a part of this forum and seeming to be associated with NAFPS , some people might have the impression that you and your website are accepted as legit in the Native community. Maybe they are. I don't know. My point is, some people try to use this website and want to seem like they are part of the good that is done here, but it turns out it is only for self promotion.

I wasn't concerned at all until I saw you post trying to attract those vulnerable young people into an interaction with your group , claiming you had an office and 19,000 members, which I doubted was true. That made my alarm bells go off.

As people say, time will tell and trust is earned, but people shouldn't presume people who they don't know are trustworthy.

[wolfhawaii]

Perhaps it is just my Cherokee need for balance, but it doesn't seem fair that you, Moma Porcupine, take Tsisqua to task for not having written an introduction until now, when you have not done so for all the years you have been on here. You can do an intro that does not disclose your identity if you have those concerns. We know so little about you yet we see your many posts and newcomers feel as if you are an authority, even though you have occasionally stated that your credentials are unimpressive. In Cherokee communities it is assumed that people who are still acquiring competency will speak less and listen more; i have seen this value in other Indian communities also.

[wolfhawaii]

Moma Porcupine, I have read your posts here for several years, and i have yet to see you post who you are. Anonymity is often important to avoid repercussions in exposing frauds and abusers. ...... yet i also personally know at least one formerly valued member here who left due to your heavyhandedness. I urge you to think about your approach carefully.

It is not considered good form to use others to validate oneself, but there are connections that people of a common heritage have that allows others to know where they fit in. Language is one way. Cultural norms are another very important way. Geographic location is another. I know where Lost City is...do you? I do not "know" Tsisqua since she is anonymous, but it is entirely possible that i may have met her since i used to live in UKB country. I acknowledged her in a common language and she responded appropriately. This can be done in English as well but English is a slippery language unlike Cherokee. I have not seen anybody use their NAFPS membership to validate themselves in other ventures, but as you raise the possibility it makes me wonder why you are here and how you have so much time to devote to this site. Indians know that communication happens on multiple levels; there is a saying....listen, or your tongue will make you deaf! You said....."There are many other people posting here who aren't anonymous, and presumably even if I'm not trustworthy, at least some of them are,  and they will probably say something if I get out of line. "
With love and respect....consider it said.

[zoi lightfoot]

You know I am from an era and remember the pain well,when raising awareness meant camping out on a strangers floor,crippling yourself with phone bills and relying on the kindness of non indian peoples who just wanted to do the right thing.
Not all non indian peoples with an interest in our peoples are frauds and not all indians doing their bit are either,some manners are in order right now.
You note Momma Porcupine i don't use a tag,I have a name and i am not ashamed of it,its been around and wandering the halls of the UN a lot of years,I don't google,facebook or my space better things to be doing  quite frankly.
No one cares if who ever has an office only you,get some prospective.

[Moma_porcupine]

There is some big differences between anonymously collecting information off the internet, showing what people are advertising, who they say they are and how that fits with what tribal leaders have to say about those things, and anonymously hosting a website for socializing -  which also claims to monitor everyone 24/7 while they do so, and includes chat rooms for youth. 

As for what I do here, ( and why is this about me - I am not trying to promote anything )I may post a lot, but I have never misrepresented myself.

I have asked the people involved with this site, who I know aren't exploiters, or quietly supporting exploiters, to let me know if I ever take away from the purpose of this site. If any of them ever want to ask me to tone it down or completely shut up, I would be very happy to do so.

And wolfhawaii - don't blame me if I posted an advertisement showing someone who happened to be you supporting a questionable person . I never pointed out this person was you and it was an publicly advertised event.