World Council of Elders & Woody Vaspra

[Cat]

Here is the flyer that was sent to me... also Woodys and others emails do not work on his main site.
Cat


Welcome to International Sundance 2008!

The International Sundance is the manifestation of a vision carried for many, many generations – an extraordinary gathering of family from the four directions in sacred ceremony to honor the Great Spirit, our Mother Earth, and all life.  This second annual gathering is so unique because Elders from indigenous cultures around the globe will come together to add their traditional ceremonies and teachings to the time-honored wisdom of the Traditional Sundance of the first peoples of North America.  It is a time for celebration, for sharing, for remembering our true selves, for healing, for prayer, for guidance, for restoring balance between female and male energies, and for reaching out to our brothers and sisters all around the world.  We are honored that you will be adding your prayers, love and support to this joyous celebration of family.

“The essence of this International Sundance was granted by the Great Spirit
   thousands of generations ago to our sacred and holy ancestors.  It has been
   enhanced by the guidance and direction of the Great Spirit through many
   humbling ceremonies to this time and day.

- Frank Settee, Cree/Ojibwe/Lakota Ceremonial Elder 
         Grandfather of the International Sundance

The Second International Sundance will take place in Hawai’i from Wednesday, November 12 – Sunday November 16, 2008 on magnificent, sacred land in Hawai’i.  Like all Traditional Sundances, International Sundance will take place entirely outdoors, and our goal is to leave the smallest possible footprint on the land during and after the ceremonies.  Therefore, we are bringing in all facilities and equipment for the event, and will be packing them out again. 

As mentioned above, International Sundance is a gathering of family, and requires a community effort.  We invite you to assist in the preparations, and to experience and harmonize with the heart and spirit of this sacred place as part of your personal preparation for the ceremonies.  Then during the ceremonies, everyone will help out with community activities in addition to supporting the Sundancers and assisting the Elders.  This sacred gathering will be a wonderful opportunity to actively practice earth-honoring and community-supporting skills while joining in prayer and ceremony for the benefit of our Mother Earth and all life.

More information will be forthcoming regarding the International Sundance agenda, how to prepare, travel & onsite logistics, registration, key contacts, what to bring, and protocols for the ceremonies.  Also, please contact us anytime with your questions, and to find out how you can help.

Thank you for choosing to be a part of this special event to honor the Peoples of the Four Directions and the Kanaka Maoli (Native Hawaiians). 

Mahalo nui loa & Mitakuye Oyasin,

Woody

Woody Vaspra
International Sundance Chief
WORLD COUNCIL OF ELDERS

[Defend the Sacred]

Maybe Hawaii is becoming the new Sedona???

For decades now, some areas of Hawaii have been Sedona for people with even  more money. Tourism is a major industry there, and I think as early as the seventies spiritual tourism started becoming part of it. The Rebirthing cults I encountered in the eighties had retreats on Hawaii, and used Hawaiian terminology for some of their Nuage constructs. There's also at least one American witchcraft tradition that claims to be based on Huna. I don't think there's any connections in any of these to anything authentically or traditionally Indigenous Hawaiian. But people like their tropical vacations served up with their spiritual fantasies...

And WTF on the "Hopi Sundance"... geez....

[shoshone1]

Is there anyways we could contact the Native Hawaiian Elders and ask why they are allowing i come about ,,, Sheesh

[Cat]

I am waiting for replys to letters sent - I only know one elder there and more activists... The activists usually take a long time to get back to email so we will see..does anyone else have contacts there??
cat

[wolfhawaii]

I spoke to a respected elder friend of mine on the Big Island; apparently Arvol Looking Horse is trying to track down Woody Vaspra. I would assume that this sundance would not be authorized.

[Jerzy]

I know Woody, and up until five years ago, spent a lot of time with him in Canada while he was visiting Grandfather William Commanda and Grandmother Lillian Pitawanakwat.
I have a lot of stories about him that I would be glad to share privately.
The most important thing to know about him is that he is deeply involved with a new age cult called Kryon (you can Google their website) based in Boulder, and that this World Council fo Elders is a part of their efforts to basically steal the medicines of Native peoples for thier own purposes.  The story that Grandfather Martin was the one that asked him to start it is not true.
The other important thing people should know is that he is using a pipe that was given to him by Grandfather Commanda with the explicit instruction that he was not to smoke it or use it in ceremony.  This was at a time that I was a helper to Grandfather and I was there when William decided to give him that pipe.

[educatedindian]

The Kryon cult is a big part of the Indigo Children nonsense, covered in a couple other theads. Also
http://www.autism-pdd.net/testdump/test20164.htm

From their own site, they seem like paranoid conspiracy theorists as well. "Secret world govt" "neural implants" etc.
http://www.kryon.com/k_38.html

Apparently the indigo/Kryon people do a lot of exploiting of Mayan and Hopi beliefs.
http://indigosociety.com/archive/mayan-prophecies-f31.html

BUt do you have anything you could show us as proof of Vaspra's ties to the Kryon cult?

[wolfhawaii]

anybody have an update on the event which was supposed to be held  12 Nov 08?

[Jerzy]

Here is proof of Woody Vaspra's connection to Kryon ..http://www.kryon.com/k_42.html .. Go to Chapter 14.  He also was a part of Kryon events in Ottawa about four years ago"honoring" Grandfather Commanda.  And there are numerous references to him on the main Kryon site.

[simplyme]

I have known Grandfather Frank Settee for 8 years. I have sat in Ceremony with him many times, had many conversations with him, traveled with him once and attended his family’s Sun Dance. What I know of Frank comes from him and my experiences of him. Of course, I am just one person, and in a forum like this you cannot know who I am, if I am a decent person of sound reasoning and good character (I like to think I am), or just spouting BS. And in the end, as Frank says, if you have an issue with a person, or questions, go and sit with that person, as no-one else can address them. And if you have a dispute with a person, sit down with them to resolve it, and if you cannot, pray for them and look at your role in the dispute, for that is all you can act on and none of us are entirely innocent. The only one who can truly know our path and judge us on it is the Creator.
As such, Frank would not expect or even wish to have someone speak on his behalf.
I choose to do so here as I have a deep respect and affection for him, as an elder, and as a human being.

I will address some misinformation that was in a previous post, regarding Frank’s heritage.
Frank’s grandfather traveled to Canada with Sitting Bull, and remained when Sitting Bull returned South. Frank is originally from Manitoba, where his Ojibwe grandmother lived, but has lived in British Columbia for many years.
He reconnected with family in South Dakota a long time ago, and when I met him he carried many teachings and ceremonies from his Grandmother, and was responsible for the family Sun Dance Pipe, which he passed on in the traditional manner to a younger man in the family about 4 years ago.

As to Woody, I have met him only a few times.
I first met him at a small gathering of elders our community hosted in 2001 and had the impression that he was a sincere and spiritual man with a good heart and a big dream: to bring elders together from all around the world to work together for the good of people and our Mother Earth. He spoke a little of his Hawaiian roots and traditions at that time. I witnessed him dance at Frank’s family Sun Dance in 2003, saw him at Grandfather William Commanda’s gathering in 2004, and spoke to him a year or so ago when he was at Frank’s home, it was at that time I learned that he had been passed the Sun Dance.
That is all I can say that I know of Woody.

I have never met a more spiritual, non-judgmental, or giving person than Frank. He is kind, compassionate, accepting, respectful, humble and has a wonderful sense of humour. He will not speak ill of others and does not approve of gossip, conjecture or game-playing. I have never heard him refer to himself as an elder, nor have I seen him behave or speak in a manner which would indicate he thought of himself as any more important than anyone else, yet always held himself to a very high standard of responsibility for the ceremonies, medicines and tools that he carried and his availability to the people for ceremony and leadership.

There is much more I could say, but I will leave it at that.

[educatedindian]

No one is questioning Frank Settee that I can see, except to wonder if he realizes he is being used by Vaspra to appear legit.

From your own post, you don't know Vaspra very well, and the fact that you were naive enough to believe an obvious white man is Hawaiian, or that a white man claiming to be a Hawaiian healer would also be given the right to do carry out a Sundance, says that there is much about both cultures you do not know.

It would also help clear up matters if you would introduce yourself.

[simplyme]

The reason I posted regarding Frank was Post 11: "Just found this - does anyone know Frank Settee? I am "assuming this is the elder that Woody is saying gave him this altar."
As well, as I said, clearing up some misinformation, from another source but in the same post, regarding his heritage.

While I can't see Frank allowing himself to be used by anyone meaning ill, I can't say that it is impossible either.

As I indeed said, I don't know Woody well. I did not say that I believed he was 100% Hawaiian nor that he claimed to be, only that he spoke of his roots and traditions - why wouldn't I believe him, as I do not, in fact, know anything of the traditions or culture of the Hawaiian people ? I was only providing an impression I had received, and a few facts, some of which concerned some of the questions here.
Nor do I claim to know anything of - I don't.
I don't claim to know much about the Lakota traditions or culture either, just a very little.
As I said, there is more I could say.
Please don't assume that ignorance = naivete.

You will find my introduction in the appropriate place, posted shortly after I posted here. Mind you, I don't understand how that will "clear up matters". Or was there a list of required information I am to provide that I missed somewhere?
Or is it just that newcomers are suspect without a pedigree?
Sorry, that was a bit sarcastic, but the tone of your post seems a little agressive and dismissive.
Nice to meet you.

[educatedindian]

Nice to meet you as well. You'll notice that Pat greeted you warmly in your intro. What I was asking is if you could tell us more about how you came to know Vaspra and Settee. You mentioned ceremony with Settee, but I don't think you are NDN, or you would have mentioned it as NDNs generally do upon meeting other NDNs. "Who are your people?" etc. So I'm only guessing when I say you seem to be a non-Native interested in taking part in Native traditions. And as I think you'll see by looking more at NAFPS, there are many such people who get misled.

[simplyme]

Hello Educated,

Sorry I haven't been back for a long time, hope you don't think I have been avoiding...

First off, I have no First Nations ancestry that I am aware of, nor have I attempted to find any (I have been encouraged to as my genealogy on my mother's side is hazy, and my father's ancestry may well have Mi'qmaq heritage) as it would be so far removed as to be irrelevant IMO, and I do not feel the need to be able to declare that my great-great-great... was an Indian.
So, I consider myself to be a true Canadian mutt - I look white, was raised white, know some of my European genetic ancestry, and the rest is anybody's guess.
"My people" are my family, friends and spiritual community.
I would not say that I am interested in taking part in Native traditions so much as that they are part of my life, that is, the ones that I have been taught about and experienced over the years, by an Elder who is acknowledged as such within his own traditional community.
I don't dabble in different ways or "mix medicines", and have no interest in participating in new-age, pagan, wiccan, shamanic or "rainbow" activities. Not that I deride them, if they are occurring in a good way, do no harm, don't manipulate or try to take advantage of others, etc. etc.
I've been educated about, and seen firsthand, people (of all backgrounds) who abuse, misuse and profit from traditional ways and ceremonies, and who use, manipulate and take advantage of people who do not know any better (or don't care to).
I am well aware that many people are "seeking" and are easily misled - in that regards, I have also attempted to educate some about asking questions and not blindly believing anything, and to check out sites like this one.
As to further details, I prefer not to post them on a public forum, but have no problem with conversing via PM with you.

I have already given the information in regards to meeting Woody, I really don't have any more to add.
As I said, I cannot claim to really know him, and it has been years...

As to Frank, I first met him at a sweat lodge ceremony I was invited to just over 8 years ago. Over the years, Frank has been an important part of my spiritual life, but is also close to my heart in a personal way as well.

My original post was prompted by someone asking about Frank, and to correct some misinformation (that he was a descendant of Sitting Bull, amongst other things <roll eyes>).

I have no issue with this thread, and perfectly understand it - my concern was addressing the question regarding Frank.

Hope this answers your (and anyone else's, too) questions.
If not, feel free to contact me.

Happy Spring!

[Defend the Sacred]

Vaspra is still at it, and it looks like he may be trying to expand, with an upcoming pay-to-pray in Australia in November where they're charging $250 a head to participate in a fake Sun Dance.

L/D/N spiritual leaders have contacted us to say that Vaspra is also violating ceremonial protocol by telling participants that it is not necessary to have the sacred items required for the ceremony (and indeed the things required for any legitimate L/D/N ceremony. But he does remind them to bring sunscreen!). They say it is clear that Vaspra is not a member of any L/D/N community, nor does he know the language. They say he is probably fooling the Australian Aboriginal people into going along with this.

http://www.worldcouncilofelders.org/calendar.html

This annual gathering is so unique because Elders from around the globe come together to add their traditional ceremonies and teachings to the time-honored wisdom and practices of the Traditional Sundance of the first peoples of North America. Every year, the International Sundance will travel to a different location around the world including Australia in 2010, Central America in 2012, and later to Africa, Asia and Europe. Each one-of-a-kind gathering will honor the traditions, ceremonies and wisdom of the host cultures and other international participants as well as those of the Traditional Sundance.

Vaspra sent an email to those whose participation they are soliciting, with dates, locations, recommendations on air travel, and prices to participate.

The 4th International Sundance will take place from Tree Day, Wednesday, November 10 through four days of dancing, Thursday, November 11 – Sunday, November 14, 2010.  The Sundance grounds are located on Ngarrindjeri Elder, Major Sumner’s (“Moogy”) sacred land on the Coorong (“long water”) in South Australia approximately 12 miles (20kms) from the nearest town, Meningie, and approximately 100 miles (160kms) from the nearest airport in the city of Adelaide.
...
While in South Australia, we selected the Sundance site on the Coorong, and met with local ISD-Australia Committee members to kick-off onsite preparations for the International Sundance.  With the help of committee members and other contacts of Moogy’s, the grounds are being cleared and prepared, lumber is being collected for the arbor, and other necessary materials and supplies are being gathered.  There’s a lot of interest in the Sundance around Australia, and we’re planning for a larger gathering this year including Elders from many Aboriginal cultures!
...
Also, we’re planning a public event or two for the weekend before International Sundance (November 5-7) to include indigenous music & dance from many cultures as well as visiting Elders sharing aboriginal wisdom and teachings.  That’s another reason to arrive in Adelaide the week before Sundance!
...
Sacred Items… We recommend that you don’t bring feathers unless you have a tribal affiliation card.  Even so, uninformed Customs agents could confiscate your items.  You may want to avoid that potential by leaving your sacred items at home.  Please contact Woody with any questions.
...
Donation… We’re asking for a donation of $250.00 each from Sundancers and Supporters to help cover the costs of providing ceremonial materials & supplies; kitchen facilities and food; portable toilets and sinks; camping gear; ground transportation, etc. as well as to help fund travel costs for Elders coming to share wisdom and ceremonies at the International Sundance.  If you (or someone you know) can help out with a larger donation to help with Elders’ travel, etc., it would be greatly appreciated!  The best way to make your donation is via PayPal on the www.worldcouncilofelders.org <http://www.worldcouncilofelders.org/>  website. On the home page, click on Donate Now, and then click on the Donate button.  Or you can send a check to:  World Council of Elders, P.O. Box 7915, Boulder, CO  80306.  Please make your donation by September 22, 2010  to ensure that needed advance funds (including travel costs, deposits on equipment, kitchen items, toilets, etc.) are available in time to prepare for the International Sundance.  Mahalo (Thank you) !

Traditional LDN spiritual leaders are trying to contact the Aboriginal people who are hosting this, to let them know Vaspra has no right to conduct these ceremonies, and certainly no right to run them as pay-to-pray, mix and match, events by and for non-L/D/N people.