Ishi "Fire Cloud" Crosby & Sarah "Eagle Song" Crosby-van der Zee

[Prairie Fairy]

These people are kind of friends of mine. Ishi is Cree who was adopted out at birth to a white family in Liverpool, England. He and a guy named Taco Blom have a Permaculture Gardening school together and I volunteer at the garden. They do Inipis. Sarah was born in Indonesia which was a former Dutch colony. She's a white dutch woman.

I participated in some of their Inipis but I have come to understand that non Lakota people have been expressly asked to not do Inipis. I always try to talk to them about radical politics but they seem to think it's all a bunch of weakness and they always avoid it.

[Prairie Fairy]

They are members of the same "Susquehannock tribe" as Waynonaha Two Worlds. They were trained by Archie Lame Deer. I tend to avoid "pay to pray" situations with them but I just found an old flyer from some years ago when they were definitely charging money for learning the "Red Road" along with some Jungian interpretations of the King Arthur story.

[earthw7]

They have no right to do this

[Prairie Fairy]

I have had a bad feeling about it.

I did e-mail Ishi talking about Arvol Looking Horse's request. Still haven't got an answer. I may end up still in contact with them via the garden. What other actions could I take? They are both self defensive persons who do not like getting into critical discussions, but do enjoy talking about others behind their backs. I'm at a loss. I hate to think of quitting the garden.

[Prairie Fairy]

Here is a link for Ishi (David Ian)'s partner, Taco Blom. I did not highlight Taco in my first post because he is quiet and hardworking, and does not womanize as Ishi does. However, as you will see, he is also conducting Inipis and selling drums. He is an olive skinned Dutch man, I think he has some ancestry from Spain.

http://www.tonanzi.nl/

[Prairie Fairy]

Link to the About Us page of the Permacultuur School Nederland:

http://www.permacultuur.eu/wiezijnwij/wiezijnwij.htm

It's confusing because Permaculture gardening is a good cause.

[Defend the Sacred]

Here is a link for Ishi (David Ian)'s partner, Taco Blom. I did not highlight Taco in my first post because he is quiet and hardworking, and does not womanize as Ishi does. However, as you will see, he is also conducting Inipis and selling drums. He is an olive skinned Dutch man, I think he has some ancestry from Spain.  http://www.tonanzi.nl/

Uh, maybe this is a culture/language gap but... he calls himself "Taco"?

Anyway.

We see here: http://www.tonanzi.nl/vision.html

Vision Quest
...
De kosten zijn € 450

and here:

Zweethutceremonies

So, they're selling "Vision Quests". They even show us the nice country house where the "vision quest" takes place. *cough cough* Doesn't say how much they charge for the sweats. You know that house looks familiar... I think we've seen it in ads for other shameons.

Oh, fabulous, they host an "indianenweek" http://www.tonanzi.nl/vuurenaarde.html

Here they are combining "firewalking" with fake Inipi: http://www.tonanzi.nl/vuurtraining.html

Seems pretty clear: Shameons selling fake Plains NDN ceremonies. Move to frauds.

ETA: More from the site where they hold the retreats: http://www.centrelothlorien.com/

vanaf de heuvel met Tipi

http://www.centrelothlorien.com/toelichting2008.html#vision

Vision Quest
26 april tot 3 mei

Inhoud
Vision quest betekent letterlijk "zoektocht voor je visioen". Het is een ritueel dat in heel veel varianten in heel erg veel culturen voorkomt. Je laat in feite even alles wat je bezighoudt in het leven los en zoekt de verbinding met de wezenlijke weg van je ziel.
Vier dagen en vier nachten verblijf je alleen op een plek in de natuur met alleen Water; geen voedsel, geen koffie, geen alcohol , geen afleiding. Zo wordt je steeds helderder om de antwoorden op je vragen te vinden.

We helpen je om goed voorbereid aan jouw quest te beginnen en terwijl je alleen bent steunen we je op afstand. Je belangrijkste bondgenoot is de Natuur zelf. Zij zal je dragen en helpen de antwoorden te vinden op jouw vragen.

Wij raden je af een Vision Quest te doen als je in een labiele periode van je leven bent of als je momenteel psychotherapeutische hulp krijgt om goed te funktioneren.

AANMELDEN UITERLIJK 1 APRIL!!!

Cursusleiding
Taco en Carolyne Blom- Reyneveld
Meer informatie: www.Tonanzi.nl, 0570 601155, of 0615058755, ikbenik@Tonanzi.nl

Prijs
De kosten zijn € 450,- Dit is Inclusief verblijf in tenten (tijdens de voorbereiding en na terugkeer).
Voor een meerprijs is verblijf in een kamer mogelijk. Zie VAKANTIEVERBLIJF.

http://www.centrelothlorien.com/toelichting2008.html#indiaan

Indianenjeugdweek
21 tot 25 juli

Inhoud
Tipi's bouwen, indianenverhalen beleven, overleven in de natuur, kortom ervaren hoe de indianen leefden en vooral hoe zij omgingen met de natuur.
De activiteiten worden georganiseerd op het terrein van Lothlorien en in de omliggende bossen en uitgestrekte natuur. Activiteiten worden altijd aangepast aan de leeftijd van de deelnemers en zijn actief, uitdagend, creatief en vooral leuk.

Begeleiding
Richard Slager – activiteitenorganisator en -begeleider op Lothlorien – geeft al een aantal jaar invulling aan jeugd en kinderactiviteiten in binnen en buitenland.
Fredy Wamelink, brengt vanuit jarenlange ervaring in het onderwijs , theater en jeugdactiviteiten haar visie en ervaring over op de deelnemers.

Prijs
Variërend per activiteit: € 7,50 tot € 25,00
Hele week, 10 dagdelen: € 85,00
Bij deelname van meerdere kinderen uit een gezin aan de hele week hanteren wij de volgende kortingen
Tweede kind: 25% korting
Vanaf derde kind: 50% korting

[Prairie Fairy]

Uh, maybe this is a culture/language gap but... he calls himself "Taco"?

[/quote]

Struck me funny too. Gave him his privacy about it.


I guess there was quite a lot about these folks I did not want to see.

Passing stereotypes on to the children. Screwed up stuff.


Here's a link to the School voor Sjamanisme where they all met, and where Taco met his wife. I think there are some bigger fish there.

http://www.schoolvoorsjamanisme.nl/engels/home.html

http://www.schoolvoorsjamanisme.nl/engels/teachers.html

Ishi Crosby (1954) His work and passion is “earth healing???, which he applies by working spiritually, ecologically, and socially at the same time. He gives trainings about the strength of the 12 archetypes of the King Arthur legend and about the concept of the spiritual warrior. The trainings he does together with Sarah Eagle Song Crosby- v/d Zee. He gives the trainings together with Sarah Crosby-van der Zee
Information: 0570-633628, email: greenlife87@hotmail.com

Sarah Crosby-van der Zee (1950) After a youth in which I was fed with fairy tales, stories, music and nature, I have arrived at a new phase now, after a fascinating journey through adulthood which gave me two beautiful sons and four grandchildren and my partner for life, Ishi. Now, the most important thing for me is meeting: really seeing one another from heart to heart. The joy of recognition, applying my energies to the World and Mother Earth by means of massage and sound, and networking with all forms of positive change. I am looking forward to meet you!
Information: 0570-633628, email: greenlife87@hotmail.com

Taco Blom-Reyneveld (1962) is a gardener, tree caretaker, and co-founder of the Permacultuurschool Nederland. (Permacultuur is cooperation with Nature in a healthy and efficient way). He is an ex-student of the School voor Sjamanisme and followed several other courses and trainings. Together with his wife, Carolyne, he inspires ‘Tonanzi??? with sweat lodge ceremonies, drum building and other shamanistic activities. His power lies in Simplicity, Humour, Silence and Deepening.
Information: 06-15058755, web site: www.Tonanzi.nl

[Kevin]

"His power lies in Simplicity, Humour, Silence and Deepening."
ooooh, deepening - bring that across the big water, it would go so good with buckskin made in Hong Kong and red chicken feathers!

[chiefytiger]

Yeah once i saw that he was taught by the late Archie Firelame deer,I knew that he was not NDN. I have been to the Nederlands before and have been invited to some sweat ceremonys ,and meet quite a few ppls that was directed by AFL. As for TAco doing sweats and other NDN ceremonies .Im sorry to say that he doesnt have that right and should be asked ,As for you P.Fire all I can say is if you like to volunteer w/the garden continue to do so but dont participate in the NDN ceremonys , protect yourself. I would like to sned him a message thru email ,do you have it , wopila for speaking up ....
Chiefytiger

[Prairie Fairy]

Hey CT. Thanks for the advice. Here is the page for "contact" from Taco's website. Ishi & Sarah's email is listed above.

http://www.tonanzi.nl/contact.php

BTW, business has been dwindling for Ishi & Sarah in the past year. Sarah was complaining to me about it about a half a year ago and had mentioned that a psychic had told her there was something wrong going on. At that point I already had enough sense to be able to say that if you are doing a spiritual practice for people  that is not working it is time to stop and reevaluate. She was like "But we need money!" Hello... Wrong attitude anybody? if you need money you go work at the frikkin Taco Bell, dig ditches, anything but what she was proposing. A lot of people think they are too good for honest labor. But that was just one of the things I have said to her that seemed to slide right off as if it had never been said. Just like, er, plastic. Be careful, I don't think she has much of a conscience. Her & Ishi are both pretty expert at hearing an argument and then in a nasty sort of tattletale spirit bringing up another issue, (usually about somebody else's flaws) so they won't have to deal with what you have said. Not the fair debating tactics my highschool English teacher once discussed.

I have been to two Inipis with Taco but I do not know him well as he tends not to reveal much about himself. I felt that he was a good man who held himself to certain standards. But what he does is obviously wrong. It is possible that he will be receptive to well-founded criticism, if he is not too distracted by the investments he has made in his way of doing things. On the other hand he has a more developed and systematic business. Ishi and Sarah both seem to sincerely believe in their illusions, even to the detriment of their business, although Sarah's obviously channeling some ruthless Dutch colonial ancestor the way she approaches money sometimes. Ishi seems reluctant to face the fact that he is economically dependent on exploitation and seems to depend on Sarah to make the really gory ethical calls.

As you may guess Ishi's persona comes off as somewhat fictional. I'm a bit like that myself and am used to dealing with that so it did not ring off any alarm bells for me. I knew pretty much at the beginning of our aquaintance that he was having affairs and calling it polyamory, because I have been interested in polyamory myself and was fully aware that someone who has affairs is not the same thing no matter what they call it. He is more into schmoozing people and entering an idealistic dream world also with people like me, but you will reach a point with him where he is not really interested in discussing making these dreams a reality, and is only interested in continuing his own addictive cycles of sex, ego and illusion.

PF

[Barnaby_McEwan]

Her & Ishi are both pretty expert at hearing an argument and then in a nasty sort of tattletale spirit bringing up another issue, (usually about somebody else's flaws) so they won't have to deal with what you have said. Not the fair debating tactics my highschool English teacher once discussed.

I gather alcoholics do the same thing. If you get angry when they get drunk, the argument may well turn from one about how they shouldn't be drunk, into one about why you shouldn't be angry with them.

[Defend the Sacred]

I gather alcoholics do the same thing. If you get angry when they get drunk, the argument may well turn from one about how they shouldn't be drunk, into one about why you shouldn't be angry with them.

Or about how it's your fault they drink. Or your fault they cheat. Or your fault they hit you.

[chiefytiger]

Hau! P.Fairy wopila for hearing my advise ,Im sure that when you talked of what you said was said to ears that was closed .But again just be careful and keep your distance of what your chante tells you. One must be careful at all times . But when one speaks of bringing sex and affairs into spiritalty ---- RUN AWAY real fast and far . But Im sure your journey will have alot of twists and turns .... Be safe an well Kola
ChieftyT

[Litsehimmel]

Ishi "Fire Cloud" Crosby is now active in the Dutch province of Fryslân. Supposedly 'chief of the Pipe Society of the (European?) Susquehannock Tribe' he works with a woman named Margriet Wolf who calls herself Margriet "Many Fires White Rainbow Wolf". The 'wolf' bit actually is her real surname I think. She is a member of the Susquahannock Tribe of Florida. She is a 'body-oriented psychotherapist, emotional body-oriented trauma therapist, masseur, healer and guide who specializes in the (therapeutic) guidance of adults and children with traumas who need extra help'. Her target group includes "children or adults with autism related disorders, delusions, mental handicaps, ADHD, high sensitivity or something similar."

Her website is manyfires.nl and she also appears on the site http://susquehannock.net/societys_in_europe/dutch/wolf.htm Apparently she is the chief of the Dutch 'Wolf Society''Wolf Society' which promotes "spiritual growth according to Indian or druidic tradition". On June 26th she will welcome Robin Youngblood, another acquaintance of this site I think. Robin will give personal readings and healings.
Margriet Wolf is also a water pourer during sweat lodge ceremonies and urges people with "phobias, depression, trauma, AIDS, lung disorders, etc" to participate in the ceremony. She does advice against participation by people who either have a pacemaker or suffer from "certain cardiac disorders or forms of breathlesness and contagious diseases" but states that she is "a trauma expert" and she will be able to advice people whether or not they can participate.
She also teaches the Wolf Clan Teachings by Grandmother Twylah Nitsch. During the course everybody will creates their own little medicine wheel by using 'indian beads'. Participants 12 years and older. Margriet's

Another seemingly important member of this gang is Jolanda "Sun Crow" (chief of the Crow SOciety http://www.crowsociety.com/crows.html) who says she was initiated by 'black shamans' in Mongolia after the spirit of a 13th or 14th century wise woman possessed her. Her 'tribe members' are all shamans or healers or mediums and all but one of them are Dutch, the exception being one Belgian. They're also all members of the European Susquahannock tribe.

Finally, about the seemingly humorous name of Taco: it's the Latinized (and standard Dutch) form of the Frisian name Taeke. Pretty common over here ;-)  If you want more info or a translation, I'll try to give it if I can. These people - or at least Margriet Wolf - are less than 30 minutes away from here.

Litsehimmel