Santee of South Carolina??

[earthw7]

I know Chuck Ross and had the pleasure of many conversation with him, Indian country is small we all know each other, I can tell you after many years of research Chuck was quoting what the books wrote at that time, since then we have been putting together our winter counts and doing our own history, as far as calling the Tribal office it would be the same as calling mine you will talk with secretary who dont know their whole history, I would if you could provide some evidence different then what we have put together for the Lakota-Dakota-Nakota people, i would be willing to listen, I know that we were in the Mississippi valley in 900 so are you saying we then traveled east then to the west or you say a band of our people traveled east or was it was family that travel east? Then could you tell me which band of the Isanti were in the east? I know the whole nation was not there. I have the archaeological dwelling of our people in Michigan in 1400, provide the information i am willing to listen and add it to our information if there is eveidence. Plus what are the names of the people?

Hello Earth 7,

What I suggested about calling the Tribal offices, even if it was an office worker answering the phone they would still likely to be able to give an interpretation of the migration mural on the wall of the tribal offices or put one in touch with some one who could. I have no evidence other than what I have read in Dr. Ross's book and what I have been told by other Santee Sioux tribal members. I am not "saying" anything other than what I quoted from his book. I am not a tribal historian, nor am I an anthropologist.

I  met Chuck back about 1989 when his first book was published. We met at a pow wow. I'm sure all who know him here know him better than I. I have talked to him only a few times both in person and on the phone but that was over 20 years ago. My husband and I talked to him about his book, prophecies, history etc. We found we had mutual friends and acquaintances among the Santee people as well as similar life experiences on my husbands side. I found that my birthday was about 2 weeks before his, so we're both a couple of oldsters.

I have only read his first book, sad to say but I'm sure more information has been uncovered and updated in the last 25 years. What was interesting to us was at about the same time we met Chuck and discussed origins of our peoples in particular the Santee and where they came from before arriving on the shore of this continent, we met a Native woman from the West Coast (Chumash) who spoke of her tribes migration and arrival on this continent. Each spoke of where they say they were as a people before that. Each story matched but from opposite costs. We have talked to Elders from the "Americas", North, South and Central  all have similar stories. Back about that time we met and listened to a Mayan Elder speak his peoples creation story, it took 4 days. So many stories very similar going back so far.

What I'm curious about is that those of you that know Chuck and respect him, don't seem to prescribe to his universal findings. Just how far does We are all related go, in your views. I am a woman, born on my reservation in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan 74 years ago. Raised here until the Government moved me. Returned after a life away from here.

By the way, we have remnants of the "Sioux' moving through here many years ago. My younger sister married a man who's father was  a Standing Rock tribal member, he had married a woman from our tribe and stayed here. My people have been here a long time but we know there were others here long ago before us.

I see that Chuck Ross has spoken at the Star Knowledge conferences but I don't think he can be compared to the Zephiers. We have ran across Mr. Golden Eagle a time or two starting when he put up that sundance/carnival at Yankton a couple of decades ago. I don't know why people get involved with him.

My interest, at this time was only about the origination of tribes not about someone trying to prove their ancient ancestry.

Thank you.

That is great I have been doing tribal histories for 25 years now finding about where the tribe moved and why I love my work, I traveled to many of the spots of where my people are from it is such an honor to be able to stand where my relatives stand. I know my family back to the 1600 by name and where we lived. I visit with a Chippewa historian who talked about the birch bark scroll of our people being in Michigan in 1200, i just love this stuff, in my area there were no people 10,000 years ago because it was great sea. We came into the area about that time the oldest remains are 9,500 years old. I know when we were in the Mississippi valley when we were in south America and we made our travels back up north again. According to the winter counts. i took a class on the being strait theory and found out that was made by a monk who came to our world with Cortez and said there is no way these people could build these cities without comes from his world so there must be land bridge. Of course that theory has never been proven but history book use it all the time to prove who we are.  I have know Chuck for a long time and like his family but i dont follow blindly anyone, i was taught never follow man because a man is just a human being who makes mistakes, So I respect chuck but dont follow. him
I have been working with coalation of tribal historian putting down our history instead of having the books tell us who we are. I am willing to listen to anyone just show me the proof because it is out there. Plus you must understand the time and age of the people you talk to because our boarding school age have been taught a different view then out traditional people. as you see with the Zephier which i know too.

[milehighsalute]

chuck would tell you the same thing.....he never expects anyone to follow him or even suggests it.....he just puts out his info/opinion and whoever chooses to agree with him will.....he once told me he has no hard feeling towards those that dont

he always been humble....and always readily admits that he is still learning himself even at his age

[earthw7]

 i would really like to find out about this history some really facts and dates, as i have on our own people if t is true and not another fable i would like to put in with our history but i have to have proof

[loudcrow]

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~prsjr/na/se/sc_pg1.htm

Santee tribe. - Named according to Speck (1935), from iswan'ti,
"the river," or "the river is there." Also called: Seretee, by Lawson
(1860).

Santee Connections. - No words of the Santee language have come
down to us, but there is little doubt that they belonged to the Siouan
linguistic family.

Santee Location. - On the middle course of Santee River.
Santee Villages. - The only name preserved is Hickerau, on a branch
of Santee River.

Santee History. - The Santee were first encountered by the Spaniards
during the seventeenth century, and in the narrative of his second
expedition Captain Ecija places them on Santee River. In 1700 they
were visited by John Lawson, who found their plantations extending
for many miles along the river, and learned that they were at war
with the coast people (Lawson, 1860). They furnished Barnwell (1908)
with a contingent for his Tuscarora campaign in 1711-12, but are said
to have taken part against the Whites in the Yamasee War of 1715.
In 1716 they were attacked by the Etiwaw and Cusabo, acting in the
interest of the colonists, and the greater part of them were carried
away captive and sent to the West Indies. The remainder were probably
incorporated with the Catawba.

Santee Population.- The number of Santee was estimated by Mooney
(1928) at 1,000 in 1600. In 1715 an Indian census gave them 43 warriors
and a total population of 80 to 85 in 2 villages.

Santee Connection in which they have become noted.- The name Santee
has been given permanency chiefly by its application to the Santee
River, S. C., but it has also been applied to a village in Orangeburg
County, S. C.

Sewee tribe. - Significance: perhaps, as Gatschet suggested, from
sawe', "island."

Santee Connections.- No words of their language have survived, but
the Sewee are regarded as Siouan on strong circumstantial grounds,
in spite of the fact that they are sometimes classed with the Cusabo.

Santee Location.- On the lower course of Santee River and the  coast
westward to the divide of Ashley River about the present Monks Corner,
Berkeley County.

Santee Villages. - In Lawson, writing about 1700, mentions a deserted
village in Sewee Bay called Avendaughbough which may have belonged
to them (Lawson, 1860). The name seems to be still preserved in the
form Awensdaw.

Santee History.- Possibly Xoxi (pronounced Shoshi or Shohi), one  of
the provinces mentioned by Francisco of Chicora, an Indian carried
from this region by the Spaniards in 1521, is a synonym of Sewee.
The name is mentioned by Captain Ecija in 1609. They may have been
the Indians first met by the English expedition which founded the
colony of South Carolina in 1670, when they were in Sewee Bay. They
assisted the English against the Spaniards, and supplied them with
corn. Lawson (1860) states that they were formerly a large tribe,
but in his time, 1700, were wasted by smallpox and indulgence in alcoholic
liquors. Moreover, a large proportion of the able-bodied men had been
lost at sea in an attempt to open closer trade relations with England.
Just before the Yamasee War, they were still living in their old country
in a single village, but it is probable that the war put an end to
them as a distinct tribe. The remnant may have united with the Catawba.

Santee Population.- Mooney (1928) gives an estimate of 800 Sewee
for the year 1600. In 1715 there were but 57.

Santee Connection in which they have become noted.- At an earlier
period this name was applied to the body of water now called Bulls
Bay. There is a post hamlet with this designation in Meigs County,
Tenn., but the name is probably of independent origin.

[earthw7]

Ok i see just another misunderstanding of words from
iswan'ti-The River compared to Dakota Isanti-The Knife people,
two different meaning and words. then the white people could not understand
the native languages so they came up with Santee for the people.
Now that cause alot of misinformation across the united States.
So our Dakota people whose name is Isanti or Isanyathi- The people of the Knife
was some how mixed with people in the east so ok its making sense now.
Since this is the name of the Nation
we all follow under the names of our Bands we dont have clans.
So The Isanti are divided into the following.
1) Sisseton
2) Wahpeton
3) Wahpekute
4) Mdewakanton

We still dont have a winter count story of coming from the east other than being east as far as the Mississippi Valley.
I have been saying this for a long time we must tell our own histories now because misinformation is out there and then
people make up the history with maybe and would if.
I am always surprised how people would think they would have a sun dance in an environment that is high in humility or was a place
were the temp were high, everything a Native does relates to their environment. Common sense so there was never a sun dance in the east
and should never be one.
We were in the Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota area in 1200 to 1863

[PalmettoPatriot]

Initial disclaimer: I am not a Santee.

I know that this is an old thread, but I wanted to chime in.  As for the two Santees, look, get over it.  There was a Santee tribe in SC.  Tons of place names and historical records that an EASTERN Siouan speaking tribe called Iswanti lived in SC.  Just accept it and move on.  No one is stealing anyone’s heritage. 
Let me tell you about a story about a surname.  There are Allen’s from the following nations: Iran, Germany, Ireland, Scotland, Breton, Wales, Cornwall, Man, and Belgium.  Only the Celtic Allens are related.  The Iranian “Alans” had the same name pronounced the same way and invaded Europe with the Huns, Visigoths and other tribes and settled in Germany.  Now, were the Proto-Germanic Iranian “Alans” stealing the heritage of the “Clannad Ailleann” of Ireland?  No.  They just had the same damned name.  Period.  How do I know this?  Because the historical record exists, just like it does with these people, or else I myself would be skeptical.  There are TONS of fake experts on this forum, for chrissakes.  Coming here and asking people rather than doing the research yourself has provided me with months of laughs and head shaking.

In reply:

“the whiteman gave people here in the east TWO choices when they were being FORCED TO MIGRATE go to oklahoma or DIE.”
Bovine Scatology.  I’ve heard this abject crap several times from Indians in the West who think that only real Indians are in the West and everyone else is fake.  So let me rattle off just a few ___FEDERALLY RECOGNIZED___ tribes east of the Mississippi right off the top of my head: Catawba, Poarch Creek, Tunica-Biloxi, Eastern Band Cherokee, Shinnecock, Mohawk, about a half dozen Seminole/Creek tribes in Florida, , Tuscarora, and many others that I am forgetting.  There are also many state recognized tribes.  If that doesn’t make you happy, many of the state recognized tribes are supported for federal recognition by their federally recognized kin.  It also doesn’t include state recognized tribes that are very close to federal recognition, like the Lumbee and the Monaco.  Besides…as bad as the Trails of Tears was – genocide was not threatened, only forced removal.  There were isolated murders and other atrocities by troops, but no one threatened to wipe everyone out.  The real injustice came along the way, when many died on the trip.  Please read history before stating history.  The real history is more interesting than falsehood.
“These peoples name was actually Iswan'ti (Catawba - People of the river).  Like the Catawba they were of the Siouan language base.  I was under the impression that more than likely they were a Catawba band and that Santee was a Spanish bastardization of their actual name.”

The Catawba were themselves a band of the Cheraw.  They became the dominant Cheraw band.

I see lots of people claiming that blacks are trying to be Indians with this tribe, but explain to me then why Catawbas, Lumbees, and Santees all share the same surnames and ancestors?  So what if they are even mostly black.  That didn’t matter to historical Natives.  They started taking captives and mixing with other races right away.  It seems to me that only Whites and racial purity obsessed Indians from the West are worried about purity. 
That sums up everything that I have to say.

[earthw7]

so none of this still makes sense as an historian of the Dakota and Lakota Oyate, I know where my people lived and when,
so that is what when i read some of those claims i have to shake my head because most of the claims are historical incorrect.
at least for my people. so the following:

“These peoples name was actually Iswan'ti (Catawba - People of the river). Referring the people in the east.

My people name is "Isanti" mean People of the Knife, the Pte Oyate,

I understand that people who don't know their language can make mistakes but as you see the word which people use today the incorrect spelling of Santee has two different meaning according to two different languages would be my first clue,   
Then the dates and time of things according to my nation and according to the people out east for events that happened.
To me its simple
So when a fraud comes out of the wood work claiming to be from a tribe but that is not related to another and then makes claims to be related other tribe and then want to do ceremonies that are not their to do then i have a problem with that. We are not christian trying to spread our beliefs around the world but we are Native who know our own way and want to keep it our way. That is why i believe we need to correct history, because people had some white guy write down their history and now that what the follow i would have some objections to that because next the people end up mixing different cultures together making a mess of things.

[Defend the Sacred]

Besides…as bad as the Trails of Tears was – genocide was not threatened, only forced removal.  There were isolated murders and other atrocities by troops, but no one threatened to wipe everyone out.

Isolated incidents? Of course the intent was genocide. For you to post something so blatantly untrue and then imply that our elders don't know their own people's history.... Wow. What have you been smoking?