Mayan legend of the thirteen crystal skulls

[den06]

Hello

I am a French member of an archaeological association (Cercle d'Histoire et d'Archeologie des Alpes-Maritimes) and I am also working in the zetetic laboratory of the Nice Sophia Antipolis University (http://www.unice.fr/zetetique/).
I am looking for the origin of the so-called mayan legend of the thirteen crystal skulls. A French researcher, specialist in Precolombian archaeology, François Gendron, has written that this legend could appear in Mexico during the XIXe century. I have contacted him and he did not manage to give me any reference. He agreed now to admit that this legend is more recent. I did not find anything more recent than the eighties (XXe s.).
Did someone get any information on this subject ?

Thanks in advance

Denis

[Smart Mule]

Hello Denis,

Here are a few links that may help as to the authenticity of the carvings, there are reference links on these pages -

http://www.archaeology.org/online/features/mitchell_hedges/

http://skepdic.com/crystalskull.html

http://anthropology.si.edu/crystal_skulls/

The above links discuss where the carvings actually came from and the manner in which they were made.

The wikipedia article dates the origin of the legend to the 1970's -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crystal_skull#cite_ref-54

You may also want to get in touch with Jane Walsh from the Smithsonian, she has done extensive research and has written a number of articles on this and similar subjects.  She can be reached at walshj@si.edu or 202-633-2208.


sky

[den06]

Hi

Thanks a lot for your answer.

I know these links (but they provide no information on the origin of the so-called mayan legend) and I am in contact with Jane MacLaren Walsh (but she has no information on the legend). There is no doubt about the modern carvings of the crystal skulls. I have all the informations about this question. But nobody traces back the mayan legend.
Wikipedia quotes the 1970's but there is no citation of the legend until the Chris Morton & Ceri Louise Thomas 's book, "The mystery of the crystal skulls", 1997. Before this date, Jamie Sams talk of thirteen crystal skulls but without speaking of Mayas. I am looking for the first personn who have mixed these 13 crystal skulls with the mayan context.
I have contacted Philip Jenkins (author of DREAM CATCHERS) too but he has not the answer. Perhaps someone in Mexico ?

Best wishes

Denis

[Smart Mule]

Hello Denis,

If after having done extensive research on the subject, Jane is unaware of the origin then I'm really not sure what to tell you.

There is a professor at University of California at Riverside by the name of Karl Taube who is an assistant professor of anthropology who may be able to offer some assistance.  Unfortunately I do not know him and do not have his contact information.

sky

[den06]

Hi

Thank you very much for this information. I have sent an e-mail to Karl Taube. Wait and see :-)

Another questions :-)

Lynn Andrews (New Age writter) is quoted on this Website.
http://64.38.12.138/boardx/post.asp?method=ReplyQuote&REPLY_ID=340337&TOPIC_ID=16605&FORUM_ID=5
It is said that The Crystal skulls trace back to her. I don't have her books. Do someone know if she has written about crystal skulls in her books ? Before Kenneth Meadows (The Medicine Way, 1990) Jamie Samms (The 13 original clan mothers, 1993) ?

Do someone know if Harley Swift Deer Reagan has written about crystal skulls himself in his books ? He is just quoted to have talk about them. Perhaps something on this subject in the Bill Wahlberg's book, "Star Warrior: The Story of Swiftdeer" ?


Thanks in advance

Denis

[tecpaocelotl]

It's a modern invention.

[den06]

Yes, I know but I research informations about its modern apparition.

Karl Taube answered me. He has no information about this question.

[educatedindian]

Hi

Thank you very much for this information. I have sent an e-mail to Karl Taube. Wait and see :-)

Another questions :-)

Lynn Andrews (New Age writter) is quoted on this Website.
http://64.38.12.138/boardx/post.asp?method=ReplyQuote&REPLY_ID=340337&TOPIC_ID=16605&FORUM_ID=5
It is said that The Crystal skulls trace back to her. I don't have her books. Do someone know if she has written about crystal skulls in her books ? Before Kenneth Meadows (The Medicine Way, 1990) Jamie Samms (The 13 original clan mothers, 1993) ?

Do someone know if Harley Swift Deer Reagan has written about crystal skulls himself in his books ? He is just quoted to have talk about them. Perhaps something on this subject in the Bill Wahlberg's book, "Star Warrior: The Story of Swiftdeer" ?

Thanks in advance

Denis

I did find a lot of references in Lynn Andrews to a character called Crystal Woman, but she claims this alleged person was someone she met in Australia among the aboriginal people.

I don't know if it's in the book about him, but H Reagan not only talks about the crystal skulls he claims to use them to communicate with elders from 1000 years ago. And his cult will even sell you their own alleged magical crystal skulls and charge you an additional fee to "activate" them. We got these emails from former members of the cult that show some of the group's inner workings.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=528.msg13721#msg13721

[den06]

Hi

Thank you for the help.

Lynn Andrews

Did she talk about crystal skulls when she gives informations about this "Crystal Woman" ? Did she explain why this person was called "Crystal" ?

Harley Swift-Deer Reagan

Interresting informations. But these mails date back from 2008. Very recent. I'd have to know when he talks about crystal skulls for the first time. That's why I asked the question about his books. Does anyone has read his books on this forum ?

Best wishes

Denis

[snorks]

You might try John Major Jenkins, who promotes 2012 and the Mayas.  He is a New Age Mayanist who written several books on the Mayas, and seems to know all the players and the skulls.  I believe that he thinks that Humbartz Mens may have something to do with the mixing of the two.

[den06]

Hi

I have written to John Major Jenkins. wait and see.

Who is Humbartz Mens ? I did not manage to find information about him ?

Denis

[den06]

Hi

John Major Jenkins answered me :
"I believe an early trigger for it was the so-called Mitchell-Hedges crystal skull";

Of course, the Mitchell-Hedges skull was the "first mayan" one. But the legend of the 13 crystal skulls has nothing to do with Frederick Albert or Anna Mitchell-Hedges themselves.

Do someone knows who is Humbartz Mens ?

Best wishes

[educatedindian]

He meant Hunbatz Men, an imposter posing as a Mayan "daykeeper" whose real name is Cesar Mena Toto. We have several threads in here that mention him. You can find them using the search button.

I briefly looked at the H Reagan book some years ago but don't recall the skulls being mentioned. I doubt H Reagan is the origin of the legend. He's very unoriginal, having ripped his ideas off from many other frauds like Andrews, Castaneda, and H Storm.

[den06]

Hunbatz Men
Nothing in his 1989 book "Secrets of Mayan Science/Religion" about the crystal skulls.

Hunbatz Men is now very well connected with crystal skulls. But since what year, before or after 1997 ?
Does he speak about crystal skulls in his other books (before 1997, Chris Morton and Ceri Louise Thomas's book) ? That is the question.
Mayan Sexual Education (1952)
K'U is Sacred In Maya, K'U is Sacred in Tibet (1991)
He was coauthor of two three books :
Mayan vision quest: mystical initiation in Mesoamerica (Cynthia MacAdams, Hunbatz Men, Charles Bensinger - 1991)
Tzol EK' Mayan Astrology (Hunbatz Men, Jaime Guerrero - 1991)
The Portent: a Story of the Inner Vision of the Highlanders Commonly Called the Second Sight (Hunbatz Men, Cynthia Macadams - 1991)

I'll ask the question directly to Humbatz. We'll see