Mexica Movement

[milehighsalute]

yep.....ill go ahead and say it

they are all frauds....and they are damaging to indians

they infilterate politics and promote mexican nationalism beyond mexican borders

their stupid ideas and misinformation get a platform in public schools and they are even allowed to start their own schools of indoctrination

on top of that they are not even culturally ndn.......mostly thinblood american chicanos with something to prove

[tecpaocelotl]

Many confuse this org as an actual movement.

Founder of the organization is Olin Tezcatlipoca. Like my mom tells me if I can't say something nice, don't say nothing at all so that is all I'm going to say.

Anyway, though they are against fraud, they go extreme on all matters.

I am confused on what you mean by this:

even allowed to start their own schools of indoctrination

I never heard of this org ever having a school of any kind.

[milehighsalute]

ill try to find the video.....they have a school in LA

for being so adamantly against frauds olin sure loves misappropriating things like medicine wheels and sweats and north american spirituality with his claims that we are all one and all came from mexica.

either way they ARE a hobbiest organization, and convince outsiders that they have us NDN's from this continent on board when they promote their mexican nationalism

they show up at powwows and participate in grand entry following our flag and eagle staff for such things like veterans day, and memorial day.........playing all nice and taking pics and trying to legitimize themselves as being one with us.....then go home writing anti-american blogs calling our vets sellouts and cannon fodder

they may not sell ceremony.....but they misappropriate it.....and they sure sell misinformation to the masses and brainwash kids

so just because they look like us i dont think they should get a pass for being phonies

i wrote about it here once http://forums.powwows.com/f40/destroying-myth-aztlan-aztec-hobbyists-68613/#post1599744
 

[tecpaocelotl]

I think you're confusing different organizations and bunching them up as one.

ill try to find the video.....they have a school in LA

Only school that I can think of that is in LA is Academia Semillas del Pueblo which is founded by Marcos Aguilar which has no connection to the organization Mexica Movement.

for being so adamantly against frauds olin sure loves misappropriating things like medicine wheels and sweats and north american spirituality with his claims that we are all one and all came from mexica.

either way they ARE a hobbiest organization, and convince outsiders that they have us NDN's from this continent on board when they promote their mexican nationalism

As much as I do not like Olin and the ways he runs things, only thing I ever remember him saying is everyone is Mexica. Everything else doesn't sound like him. At least not after the 2000's.

they show up at powwows and participate in grand entry following our flag and eagle staff for such things like veterans day, and memorial day.........playing all nice and taking pics and trying to legitimize themselves as being one with us.....then go home writing anti-american blogs calling our vets sellouts and cannon fodder

they may not sell ceremony.....but they misappropriate it.....and they sure sell misinformation to the masses and brainwash kids

Like here I think you're confusing other people and bunching them together.

I think you need to show pics or links to blog entries so I could help you separate who is who.

*Update*

Read your posts over there, I agree Nican Tlaca is dumb (In Nahuatl just mean "People here". Tlaca means man in modern variants of the Nahuatl dialects.).

[earthw7]

I have friend who are a part of reclaiming their native blood and i dont think that
lumping them all into a group if one is misrepresenting the people

[milehighsalute]

you may be right.....i may be lumping all of them into one category.....either way they all are hobbyists and the all give a nod and their sympathy to the mexica movment....which i maintain is a HATE GROUP

the more i look into it only a few promote mexican nationalism while others promote mestizo advancement and some just like to dance......but maybe its different for you guys......ever sit down and talk to them? horrible ideas and wild claims out of that crowd........its maybe because i am and injun with a spanish surname that they think im one of them.....they always try recruiting me to their little heritage club

i also believe they have no business at powwows and YES THEY DO MISAPPROPRIATE NDN' s for their own little fantasy

[tecpaocelotl]

you may be right.....i may be lumping all of them into one category.....either way they all are hobbyists and the all give a nod and their sympathy to the mexica movment....which i maintain is a HATE GROUP

the more i look into it only a few promote mexican nationalism while others promote mestizo advancement and some just like to dance......but maybe its different for you guys......ever sit down and talk to them? horrible ideas and wild claims out of that crowd........its maybe because i am and injun with a spanish surname that they think im one of them.....they always try recruiting me to their little heritage club

i also believe they have no business at powwows and YES THEY DO MISAPPROPRIATE NDN' s for their own little fantasy

I been around them most of my life. I just smile and nodded and walk away. If they say "hey, don't you want to know about your heritage/culture", just say, I appreciate what you're telling me, but I know of my *tribe here* heritage or something like that. Just don't do it demeaning.

The ones who love to dance are danzantes (which the Mexica Movement org does not like). I'll admit, they somewhat do run like a cult. Many go by following an "elder" (I posted a lot of questionable "elders" already here in the group in the research is needed area. If there are questionable people I post them here as well.). Some of the danzantes come from broken homes, formal drug addicts and gangsters who want better lives and go with that so doing something negative at them isn't going to fix it their issue. Many who have been living in the US for many generations without a connection to Mexico.

With the Mexica Movement organization, they're a bit cruel so I just say avoid them. Many who have been living in the US for many generations without a connection to Mexico.

What I been doing for some time is if you can't beat them, join them type of attitude to try to correct issues. Right now I have a group which many of the people you complain about are in the group:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/MexicaHistory

A few friends of my friends help me put correct information: codices in the file section, lectures from experts, have a discussion on misinformation with a few experts in the field, etc...

I kept it with the name Mexica History since people who are just starting only know about Mexica (around Mexica New Years, about 200 members join.)

You can check it out and probably think I'm crazy for doing what I'm doing, but I'm doing my best with my abilities to correct an issue.

[earthw7]

that is great; one of the problems is incorrect history,
We need to reconnect back to our Native Belief and culture
but it has to be the real beliefs and culture, my friends is LA
are doing what you are doing trying to correct history with these groups
I have to say I am not worried about the pow-wow culture because that is
not a traditional culture event, since it is not apart of traditional culture it is mostly
a social gathering for our people to share dance, songs, and make relatives (snagging),
when pow-wow was created after WWI it was to honor our veterans and it became a
a whole culture on its own with its own rules some of the rules go back to Christian upbring.

[milehighsalute]

i believe powwows/wacipis are traditional

 traditions have to start somewhere......but yes it it a NEWER tradition......but it is not going away anytime soon and that is where many NDNz including myself find solace......i seen more people saved through powwow than sundance (when following the "old rules")

i know the roots of powwow....  whether its new tradition or old tradition....i like to think of it as OURS and would like to keep it that way

[milehighsalute]

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=2185.0 this koyoteh guy from a few years ago breaks it down A LITTLE.....its still nonsense to me....he includes my homelands in his aztlan fantasy

[koyoteh]

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=2185.0 this koyoteh guy from a few years ago breaks it down A LITTLE.....its still nonsense to me....he includes my homelands in his aztlan fantasy

you could say that aztlan is a fantasy, from the same viewpoint that white anthropologists call all natives origin and emigration stories fantasies and myth.

is that the standpoint you are taking?

after all these years, ya bringing back this thread. THat is good.

ya say here i break it down a little. good.

been so many years though.

but let me address what you said , that i include you tribe in the fantasy.

which tribe?

and how do you know your tribe is not a part of the 'myth'?

[koyoteh]

i believe powwows/wacipis are traditional

 traditions have to start somewhere......but yes it it a NEWER tradition......but it is not going away anytime soon and that is where many NDNz including myself find solace......i seen more people saved through powwow than sundance (when following the "old rules")

i know the roots of powwow....  whether its new tradition or old tradition....i like to think of it as OURS and would like to keep it that way

exaactly.
so are your people or the pow wow people the only people allowed to do that and want others to accept that?

i talked to many cali natives and they just didn't agree. that was years ago now when pow wows were 'invading' cali territory.

but again, pow wows have an idea of being promoted as 'intertribal'. I see it that way today, but years ago they only said this but discriminated against cali natives, and apaches and others. was like 20 years ago.

it took some time and hard work to help people learn about each other and get along.

[koyoteh]

that is great; one of the problems is incorrect history,
We need to reconnect back to our Native Belief and culture
but it has to be the real beliefs and culture, my friends is LA
are doing what you are doing trying to correct history with these groups
I have to say I am not worried about the pow-wow culture because that is
not a traditional culture event, since it is not apart of traditional culture it is mostly
a social gathering for our people to share dance, songs, and make relatives (snagging),
when pow-wow was created after WWI it was to honor our veterans and it became a
a whole culture on its own with its own rules some of the rules go back to Christian upbring.

i heard many different origin stories about how pow wows developed. never heard the one about ww2 and honoring veterans. very interesting. I think maybe that was added later.
the versions heard were two versions.
one was how they started off as gathering between specific tribes.
the second i heard was Buffalo Bill's Wild West Show . In which white man Bill formed , and hired natives, and later native created dances for show. ANd the people liked it so they kept doing it.

[koyoteh]

you may be right.....i may be lumping all of them into one category.....either way they all are hobbyists and the all give a nod and their sympathy to the mexica movment....which i maintain is a HATE GROUP

the more i look into it only a few promote mexican nationalism while others promote mestizo advancement and some just like to dance......but maybe its different for you guys......ever sit down and talk to them? horrible ideas and wild claims out of that crowd........its maybe because i am and injun with a spanish surname that they think im one of them.....they always try recruiting me to their little heritage club

i also believe they have no business at powwows and YES THEY DO MISAPPROPRIATE NDN' s for their own little fantasy

they are not all hobbyists.
i know you guys like using that term. but lumping everyone together is not right. Unless you bother to learn the history of how it all developed and begin to see all the groups that are out there, you don't have the right YET to make a statement at all.
Maybe after you learn about it all you will still have the same belief, but at least learn first.

IF aztecs have no business at pow wows , then who does? And with that, the question becomes DO pow wows have the right to be spread all over the lands and outside of their traditionals ceremonies? Are the pow wow committees asking the tribes of the lands they dance in for their approval? for their permission?
the answer is not. At least not at all.

same for aztec dancers. at least 20 years ago, the dance heads did ask permission to dance in their areas. NOw i am speaking for california only, and 20 years ago.
in exchange we help them with their endeavors.

now today, is that still going on? has it gotten out of hand?
i don't know.
but i am able to ask these questions because I know that at one point in time dancers had the blessing of cali tribes to dance here.

but when we attack other nations and their dancers, i put it back to you, DO your dancers have permission to dance in other natives lands?
why not?
why won't they ask?

then agian sometimes it does happen which is why now there are more tribes involved in the pow wows because the pow wows have walked into the homes of others. ITs only fair.
especially when the slogan is "INTERTRIBAL!"

[koyoteh]

ill try to find the video.....they have a school in LA

for being so adamantly against frauds olin sure loves misappropriating things like medicine wheels and sweats and north american spirituality with his claims that we are all one and all came from mexica.

either way they ARE a hobbiest organization, and convince outsiders that they have us NDN's from this continent on board when they promote their mexican nationalism

they show up at powwows and participate in grand entry following our flag and eagle staff for such things like veterans day, and memorial day.........playing all nice and taking pics and trying to legitimize themselves as being one with us.....then go home writing anti-american blogs calling our vets sellouts and cannon fodder

they may not sell ceremony.....but they misappropriate it.....and they sure sell misinformation to the masses and brainwash kids

so just because they look like us i dont think they should get a pass for being phonies

i wrote about it here once http://forums.powwows.com/f40/destroying-myth-aztlan-aztec-hobbyists-68613/#post1599744

i know this school. intimately.
no ties to olin or mexica movement or any mexica nazi group.

its origins were from an idea and discussion that took place about 20 years ago of which i was present. It was a discussion that included mainly a specific dance group that always stood up for native rights, the peoples rights, and had the blessing of cali tribes to do work here.
in further discussions that took place , the chumash were included in these discussions.

from these discussions, we ended up with a school, midwives, traditionals medicines, security groups, marketplaces, teachers, aand gardens.

all the while also being told we didn't have the right to do thiese things by mexica movement and other mexica-nazi groups.

The school had an idea that promoted self identity. teaches nahuatl. also taught chinese. english. spanish. Kind of a language based school. The idea was identity and self esteem and bring ourselves into successful people. SELF SUFFICIENCY.

yes. danza was present. no not only aztec stuff is taught.

native elders and teachers hear about this school. many elders and teachers from other nations come by to talk to the kids and share history and stories. and yes about how we are all related.

the idea that natives can have their own school and work toward self sufficiency is something that many want but few attempt.

did they do a good job? thats something else left to be seen in the future.

did patriots want to destroy this place ? yes. The minute men especially. This school was much hated on by patriots that they threatened to kill the kids with a bomb.

yes a bomb threat.

so yes, there are still those that wish to destroy this school and kill off our kids.

yes some are even natives who are members of the minute men. and sites like SOS.org

oh and as an added note:
this school ended up also getting the blessing of the mexica councils/mesas in mexico. They sent reps. Again. I was present to witness this.