David Hobgood AKA David Spellsinger AKA Sifu David

[educatedindian]

Interesting. Isabella and Pulchara have the same identical writing styles (or lack of). Pulchara also mimics DSS's use of phrases, though I suppose that could just be hero worship talking.

To Pulchara/Isabella and Brighid: Any personal disputes you have, kindly handle them by personal emails. Don't drag your "witchwars" or other pettiness in here. Ironically the only thing you've done is revealed just how deeply disfunctional David Hobgood's following is. Anyone who creates that many enemies among what must be a fairly tiny pagan community in Whiting Indiana is someone you all should think long and hard about avoiding.

And that's not even taking into account all the many lies we've caught him in, simultaneously claiming to be a poverty stricken Cherokee-Druid healer on the edge of dying from disease and a karate master/bodyguard/death defying fighter with a successful school.

[weheli]

Thank you Joesph for clearing up the pipe. Raven is Cherokee and did come face to face with the man and she called him on his BS. Read her posting. Cherokees do have stones NEVER used as he does. Thats all I'll say on that.

It seems he wants to be a a little of everything to pull in the people. He one site sounds like an advertising/commercial "come one come all". To many incongruency in what you have posted. I am Cherokee and would love to hear the word you say would be "shaman" in our language.

My 2 cents worth.  Wado  Weheli

[Brighidsjustice]

sigh.  this is what i was trying to avoid.  i am not engaged in a "witch war".  i have not heard or seen evidence that david isn't  what he claims to be.  if anyone can show me where there is proof of fraud, please.  show me, and then this will all be over.

all i said, was that there were other people you should be looking at who might have wanted to cause david trouble other than the ex-girlfriend.  and why would i "face you"?  there was nothing to face you about!  i was there for a talk.  and it wasn't a talk from you.  no offense, but i was there to learn.  i'm not really sure how i'm attacking you, but i'm sure you'll enlighten me.  this list was forwarded to me yesterday.  i am here to get the truth.  but i will not blindly defend the man, nor will i sit back and let you attack an innocent person because of your anger.

i know your e-mail, so we can take this to a more private forum in the future.  but i did want to ask everyone who is posting on the subject, to try getting some facts.  just saying the guy is a fraud isn't really enough for me.  why do you think he is a fraud?  i've had readings from him.  the thing that raven said about the stones?  that isn't what he asks you to do.  has she really had a reading from him?  facts, people.  i want the real facts.  not just some crap because someone wants to start something.  this is why i remain a solitary pagan, and shy away from groups.

[Tobetrue]

This whole thing upsets me! This is no longer a case of people discussing whether or not this person is a fraud. This has become what was called a “witch-war??? and when this occurs the pagan community as a whole looks very, very bad.  I have read these posts and seen many cases of people assuming its one person or another who posted the original claim. This is a bad idea in any case. As a person who is out of the loop so to speak I wonder why the people “defending??? David Spellsinger (Hobgood) are focusing on another person rather than letting him tell his side of the story and leave it as that. To these people I say Grow up and let the adults handle it.  The problem with this whole thing is that people are getting blinded by emotions. We should take a look at the facts and research.  Remember that the internet is public and we all know the saying “when you assume you make an ass out of u and me. Also if these people are trying so hard to “defend??? DSS why are they hurting his reputation even more by treating this as a “with hunt???.
Just my two cents take it or leave it that is up to you.
 

[weheli]

In reply to "why didn't Raven do what he wanted her to do" very simple, he was calling it a Cherokee stone reading, Raven is Cherokee, raised with strong Cherokee traditions and knows the right ways of Cherokee things, FACT! She did not do what he said BECAUSE it IS NOT Cherokee ways. I am Cherokee and I would refuse to do something someone told me was Cherokee when I knew it to be a lie. Thats a Fact.

Real Tsalagi People Know the Way of things esp. being taught them from childhood up. No Shaman, no selling of teachings, no selling of ceramonies.Nothing is ever done for profit. Thats a Fact.

Having said that, it seems your ears are closed to the true way of things and your mind is set. I have nothing more to say.

                                                                    Wado  Weheli

[LisaBowe]

DSS: "I never claimed to be a pipe bearer of the Cherokee people."
 
ADMIN: Your followers claim differently.

Reply: Apparently you cannot read that was not one of his followers. ? He also denies it.

 
DSS "If anyone has any accusations to make, make them in an honorable way . . . face to face."
 
ADMIN: You're welcome to come here. Let's clear this up.

Reply: That's good to know, for DSS.


ADMIN: Ironic thing is, without his blind followers coming in here we would not have devoted more time to this and found out the bizarre information in the next post.

Reply: I am a against these types of websites that persuade themselves uncovering frauds. ? Yes, you posted some website information . ?  your site is now diminished and it has become, your guilty now prove your innocence. ?

[piya]

lol, this just gets like a cartoon..........................

I will look back and if the number is there, I will phone............

[piya]

Yup, I phoned the number, 214 6590639, and guess what, I got a answer machine with I think an Italian or Spanish reply on it.

Now that sure is not Cherokee or Irish.

[isabellarose66]

To Piya,
If you would re read the phone number on the first post, it was 219-659-0639, not 214, but I could see how it could happen. ? Also, ? I have to say that I am sorry, there was a mistake, ?  pulchara and I are friends, ? this is known. ? She also lives really close to me and she used my computer because I have a DSL. ?  So, she didnt log out and I posted something that I thought was under my Screen name Isabellarose66. ? But it was actually hers. ? so the post #29 was from me and not her.

 David has a lot of friends , and I am sure he has enemies also. but understand that friends will defend friends no matter what. ?  He welcomed all who question him to call him. ? His number and info are posted on the first post. ? Feel free to call. ? I also think maybe toomanybooks should give him a call. ? You have such anger for this man, then please, call him. ?  Tell him all the things you say here. ? As far as BrighidsJustice, I am still waiting for your email. ? I will be happy to talk off this list, ? I have no problems with it. ? Yes, I was angry , because people are ripping apart someone I care deeply for. ? He is family, and I hope people here would defend their family as I am. ? I suppose I could have calmed down before writing it, that I will admit, but either way, somone has it out for him. ? And that is something that should be taken care of between them. ? YOu say you dont post phone numbers? ? All of his info was plastered on the first post. ?  So anyone here who wants to confront him, even if you dont live nearby, he has a phone, he will be more than happy to talk to you. ? I urge you to call. ? ? I am not going to post any more ? .. ? But I will say it again, call him directly. ? Thank you. Isabellarose

[debbieredbear]

Brighidsjustice, people have given you facts. Read what the Cherokee people on this thread had to say. They tried to tell you he is not a Cherokee shaman like it was claimed. Does he give you good readings? Fine, but that does not make him a Cherokee.Those readings are not Cherokee. And they do not make him a Cherokee shaman. Or medicine man or any other thing. If he was all that, he wouldn't tell people. They would know. As for being a druid? There are only neo-druids now. Most of the self-proclaimed druids I have met are really just wiccans dressed up funny. A dead giveaway is calling the quarters. The Celts believed in threes. Sky. Sea. Land.  I have done my historical readings.  The 4 quarters is a greek concept. All I see with druids and wiccans is a mish mash of beliefs pulled out of context and thrown together. If that is what your Spellsinger dude is doing, then he is just another wiccan. But if that turns you on, so be it. However, the reason DSS was posted was because of his claims to be a Cherokee Shaman. So again, read what the Cherokee people have said.

[Reality]

Lisa Bowe Here!

Apparently EducatedIndian has felt it necessary to block my IP address from the system and edit my post. ? You can delete my post, but do it with the knowledge that I have cut and pasted this entire exchange to be sent elsewhere on the Internet  ? You may delete and try to hide. ? Your fraud section is geared for guilty until proven innocent. ? How many people named fraud have you personally contacted? ? Have you ever conducted research? ? I find this disturbing.

This entire exchange has been documented and copied to avoid your ability to edit my reply.

Once again, this is Lisa Bowe.

(Al's note: We don't allow spamming, nor do we allow people to be insulting or childish. If Miss Bowe wants to show the whole world how she likes to spam and be childish in order to avoid the very serious questions of deception, fraud, abuse, and profiteering that Hobgood does, or the attempts to intimidate and silence critics that she and his other followers do, that only reflects badly on her and Hobgood.

Please also note Miss Bowe still needs help with her reading skills. Hoobgood has been heavily researched. We found a long history of deception on his part.)

[Barnaby_McEwan]

Without the network of friends he has, this on line degradation of his character would continue unchecked.

LOL! You can tell a lot about a person by observing their friends. With friends like the ones who've appeared here, you don't need enemies, Hobgood!

My Grandmother (on my mother's side) was Maggie Running Fox Shoptaugh. [...] Her father was an ex- Priest of the Culdee Sect in Ireland (inserted reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culdee).

I'm quite sure you really are legally dead and talking from beyond the grave, since the Culdees disappeared, according to the page cited, in the 17th century! What a ludicrous fantasist!

I never claimed to be a pipe bearer of the Cherokee people.

But gosh, all sorts of people seem to have got the idea that you are. How did that happen? Why does it keep happening? How are you going to put a stop to it?

No one has ever said what I do is fraudulent or a pile of sh**t to my face.

Except Raven!

As you know, I am not on line...

You can get internet access for free or cheaply in any public library. Or perhaps one of your many friends, like the one who posted that message, would set up an account for you on their computer.

http://shaolinartsofwisdom.com/About_us.html
"Master Hobgood’s first Kwoon (martial arts school) “Tai Lung Gung Fu Institute???, was established in Evansville  Indiana in 1973.  The original goal of our American Kung Fu school was to offer reality based self-defense. Inspired by Bruce Lee's J.K.D. (Jeet Kuen Do) concept, Sifu Hobgood tested every technique and training method through real life combat situations. He accomplished this through his sideline as a Personal Bodyguard and as Chief of Security at one of Indiana's largest nightclubs. He also engaged in countless hours of no holds barred and or full contact fighting. Add to this over thirteen experiences in actual street self-defense situations (attempted muggings etc.) and you can understand why Sifu Hobgood is so confident that he knows what really works."

Doesn't sound very spiritual to me. Any martial arts instructor who is or appears to be continually involved in violence must, must, must be avoided. Someone like that has not learned how to avoid or defuse trouble but on the contrary seems to look for it, and will with his bragging set a dangerous example to his students, who might end up getting killed in some pointless brawl.

[piya]

Raven,

I had to read ya last post a few times, then I cottened on. I thought it was a speach from King Richard the 1st or whoever.

lol.

[JosephSWM]

It must be my age but I get confused reading all the posts, keeping track of the good guys and the bad guys. The following suggestion is partly in jest and partly serious; perhaps there could be two additional icons besides the smiley faces - a black cowboy hat and a white cowboy hat, and when someone makes a post they would have to 'stamp' it with one or the other.

Joseph

[kwa-kwen]

You are right Joseph, after reading my post I see that I need to rewrite it so it doesn't sound so jumbled. I will mofify it so it makes more sense. Sorry for the confusion. I can see if someone reads it they are going to think what the heck was that about, I know I did. LOL Will be back in little while to modify what I wrote. Thanks