Aho everyone
You know I know that there are predetors out there claiming to be healers and shamans ect. and no I do not like to see people get charged big bucks for spiritual lessons or whatever you want to call them.
I see it this way NAFPS wants to call out the fruads right? well if some non-native wanted to learn the native way and honestly walked their path why not let them learn? If a jew wants to become a baptist is this so wrong? I attend many intertribal pow wows and I think that it is great that if someone of any faith or walk of life wants to gain knowledge about our culture why not teach them? I am proud to have cherokee/french canadian bloodlines and would guide onto their path. would I charge? NO would I accept a loaf of bread for it? yep, because lets face it alot of people don't feel like they have received anything unless they some how repay you. I have studied with a shaman by the name of Maggie Wahls and she has done me no harm. I talked to here about the payment issue and she said that she has to eat to. She lives a very simple life on her land and yes, she does do some teaching on the internet but she is harmless.
runningdeer
Hello runningdeer and welcome to the board.
Let's make something clear. NAFPS does NOT discourage people from gaining knowledge. In fact, you'll find that people here will direct you to find knowledge for yourself, but to do so from knowledgeable sources. If you wanted to learn about Cherokee people, the only true way you'll ever do that is to involve yourself with a Cherokee community. It's not the type of thing that people want to hear all the time, but it's true true true. Native spirituality (spiritual ways/religion...you get my drift right?) is communal, tribal specific and often tied directly to the land that it originates in. Even among the same tribe you'll find that as you go from community to community things are practiced differently. One of the things you'll also find if you engage in Native communities is that all the things you wish to learn can be learned there for free (it's just a way of life....not a degree, doctorate, certificate or any other "title" given to it). Another strong factor is the language. Cherokee ways are only really learned from a Cherokee community and in the Cherokee language. Learning the language is learning the blueprint of a culture and the way people think, the humor, the spirituality, everything are all tied into the way it's communicated, which is NOT the same as learning in English. I realize that moving away from your home and engaging in a Cherokee community is not something done easily and I'm often asked about what a person should do if that's just not possible....where can you go?? why can't you learn from someone outside the community??
Once you remove spiritual ways from their context (the land, the community, the language) then much of the meaning is lost. What you get then is someone's interpretation of what those ways are. That's what you get with Maggie Wahls. I've reviewed her site. I have a few problems with the information I see on her site. http://www.shamanelder.com/
She makes a claim of teaching "traditional indigenous shamanism" and not the modern new age shamanism others teach. Let's examine that for a moment. What is "traditional indigenous shamanism"? What tradition? What people? Is she involved with that community actively? Does she speak the language?
I noticed she said she learned from her grandmother who traces her ways back to Asia and on her father's side she has some Apache heritage. So is she teaching Asiatic shamanism (which is where the term "shaman" comes from and also where the concept originates...that title is given to Natives by non-Natives who see similarities and lump it all together when in reality, there are stark contrasts and no Native spiritual leader involved in their community calls themselves a "shaman") or is she teaching Apache ways?? Which Apache community (they're not all the same)? Does she speak Apache???
From what I've read on her site she teaches a mishmash of different things from a lot of different cultures...a little here, a little there...so where is the "tradition" in interpreting little bits and pieces?
There are also a few things on her website that are flat out wrong. There's a lot to mention, but I'll only talk about one thing as an example and point out a passage she included on "smudging" not written by her, but reprinted on her website as legitimate information with permission from the author.
This is from an article called "SMUDGING: HOW TO DO IT--HOW NOT TO DO IT" By: Michelle Chihacou White Puma Klein-Ha
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excerpt:
"Sweetgrass
Very important to the Sioux and Cherokee nations, its botanical name is Hierochloe Oderata. In these tribes, the sweetgrass is braided like hair braids. It could be burnt by lighting the end of it, or (more economically) by shaving little bits of it onto charcoal in a brazier. Again, use charcoaled Mesquite (I believe it comes packaged for barbecue use under the brand name "Red Arrow") to burn it, not pressed charcoal tablets. Sweetgrass is burnt after smudging with sage, to welcome in good influences after the bad had been driven out. Sweetgrass is very rare today, and traditional Plains people have been attempting to protect the last of it. Myself, I believe that Cedar, which is not endangered, can safely be used this way. Also Pinon pine needles (used more frequently by the Southwest Teneh, like the Navajo and Apache as well as the Pueblo people and the Zuni) and Copal (used by the Yaqui and in ancient times by the Azteca and the Maya) have similar effect. The three mentioned here are redily available either through gathering yourself or, in the case of copal resin, from any good herb shop."
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Sweetgrass is not endangered or rare and also not only used by Cherokee and Sioux tribes. In fact it grows wild and is abundant enough that it's sold freely and used as decoration as well as for spiritual purposes. The barest of research (google) will let you know all that so you can check it for yourself. It doesn't grow in North America only either...sweetgrass also grows in Europe and Asia. The claim that it's "very rare" and that traditional Plains people have been attempting to protect the last of it are both WRONG....fallacies. The statement about burning sweetgrass after smudging with sage is something I've NEVER heard...I'm not saying that statement can't be true somewhere in some community, but it's not THE WAY or even a common practice as the author writes it here. Once again...it's interpretation and I think from the example you can see how far interpretation is from the actual truth.
I realized Maggie did not write this article, but she includes it as information for you to learn and even thanks the author for it so the person you're learning from seems to be teaching things she doesn't have a whole lot of firsthand knowledge about.....and she charges for that lack of knowledge.
I'm not sitting here making fun on her or attempting to put her down. I'm sure she has the best of intentions, but she's another that claims to have had a "calling" to teach the wisdom she's learned, when the reality is....she's got a wholllllllle lot to learn herself.
Her website is also inundated with things to buy. CD's, books etc. Even medicine bags, there's even a little Paypal window on the bottom of that page...just include what you want your bag to be made for (requested healing purpose) and she'll gather all you need and send it to you and if you wear it for 21 days....you just might be healed. Do i even need to go there??? If you'll buy this one I'll gather a few cedar branches and put 'em in a bag for you and send it to you for $15 instead of $29.....it's the same thing....you put a price tag on it then it becomes something you believe is "entitled" to you because you paid for it....if you're having financial woes or maybe unhealthy because of lifestyle factors (weight, smoking, etc) then her bag willl not help you unless you're willing to help yourself. A medicine bag will not "heal" a financial woe....managing money, not spending more than you can afford and working to get ahead will help that and you'll find that if you follow that common wisdom, your financial woes will go away independant of buying her bag.
So in all reality....you paid Maggie to teach you common sense bagged up in a "traditional indigenous shamanism" (still don't know what that means) package.
I'm not saying you should quit going to her...if you find what you need there...then go, but be knowledgeable that what you're learning is not "traditional indigenous" anything, but Maggie Wahls interpretation of things she classifies as "shamanism"(which could be anything).
I worry about you a little bit runningdeer as you call yourself a shaman in training (you used different words i know) and seem ok with someone breaking the one cardinal rule....never pay to pray. If you continue down that route you'll find a whole lot of people willing to tell you just what you want to hear for your price and the sense of entitlement from what you learn will begin to take you over you'll find yourself selling your soul on the internet and making a living off of promising better days to those you would victimize for their $$$ ('cause you gotta eat too right???)
I hope you take my words in a good way, I'm not talking down to you, I give you much more credit than that. Step back and take a look at Maggie objectively. Apaches, Cherokees...all tribes have been practicing their own spirituality since the beginning of time without a price tag on the internet...those among their communities that take up the role as healers do so as servants of their community and land....not the other way around...and they still eat without charging a price. Don't buy it.
Superdog
