Under attack by Arthur Medicine Eagle Sonier

[Needs More Caffeine]

Indy,
I have heard of that "Sundance" it was held in Indiana but from what I hear moved to Southern IL down by Shawnee National Forest, Jonesboro area and I hear Steve McCoulum(sp) is the one running it, another Fake. A lot of people in Illinois have gone to that "Sundance".
                                                 Walking-soft

Steve McCullough might do the "Sundance" in Illinois, but he still does it in Brown County, Indiana, as well.  Every year. 

I'm sorry to say that some decent Indian people in Indiana (including an elder I respect) support it because they are from eastern tribes and don't understand what is wrong with the alleged "sundance" or just assume the best of people.  I think McCullough can talk out of both sides of his mouth and please the new agers while saying things that reassure some Indian people.

[walking-soft]

Thanks for the info. "need more caf". Why are the Eastern Indians doing a Sundance? I have heard that a couple years ago some Lakota "goones" came down to put a stop from this. Jim Gillium(?) was leading that but after he crossed Steve took over. Yes there are good people there who are being terribly mislead and I am sure I know of the Elder you are speaking of.

It surely saddens my heart.
                                                          Walking-soft

[Needs More Caffeine]

Walking Soft,

You've got me on why eastern Indians would sundance.  I think there are some eastern people who support it in terms of taking food but don't necessarily participate.  Then there are some young people who don't know better.

Saddens me, too.  A really, really smart young Dakota woman came to undergrad at my uni, and she was very emotionally distraught about this sundance and the other stupid crap that goes on here under the name of "Sioux."  She ended up dropping out.  I'm hoping she'll start elsewhere, but I hate seeing a bright young person drop out in part because of having to deal with the constant appropriation of her culture.

[Mo]

Walking Soft,

You've got me on why eastern Indians would sundance.  I think there are some eastern people who support it in terms of taking food but don't necessarily participate.  Then there are some young people who don't know better.

they do it because they are accountable to no one. and many eastern nations (northeast in particular) have lost so much of the tradtional ways that they will grasp anything even if it is not theirs. we are having an issue with a group of Wampanoag people performing Iroquois social songs and dances for educational purposes and refering to them as "eastern songs and dances" thus appropriating our culture as their own. its bad enough when non natives appropriate our culture but to me its worse when other ndns do the same.

[frederica]

I agree with Mo here. Several years ago the Chief of a Lenape group on the East Coast was going to have a Sun Dance because it was Spring. He was fired by the "tribe".  He and his family were respectable, but he apparently didn't have a clue. It's unfortunate when the Culture is mostly lost, and instead of utilizing Tribal Elders the resources become another Nation. frederica

[indy]

It is sad that they must take from other tribes  to feel legitiment as ndn,s     I lived whith my wifes people on the haulapai res she was confused as to why I didnt partake in any ceremonys. I tried to explain my ways are not  her ways ,what i was taught thier was no mixing of ceremonys. I was invited to sweat but my people didnt sweat it is foreign to me.

[indy]

I talked to someone who attends the sun dance in brown county, he told me steve MCcoulough has sitting bulls pipe uses it at the sundance, is this guy lakota ?  also claims to be a pipe carrier, what is that? is it historical or made up. I had a guy come up to me at a powwow when he found out i was a stone carver said he was a pipe carrier and if i would make him a pipe, i asked what tribe he was from he said cherokee i asked him what ceromonies he conducts with the pipe he said lakota. I refused him he asked me why, I told him your not lakota and im not lakota why would i make you a lakota pipe.

[educatedindian]

http://newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=221.0

[GrammaStillLearning]

arthur medicine eagle told me yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrs ago he was not only a "card carrying indian" but a member of AIM as well.

[frederica]

What kind of card? social security, birthday, his own little group. He did have a Yahoo group for Autonomous  AIM. frederica